Aug 09 18:18:17 -->	gdm has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:18:36 <gdm>	hola
Aug 09 18:18:41 <gdm>	sorry i'm a bit late
Aug 09 18:18:57 -->	guest355 has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:19:09 <pabs>	we've not started yet
Aug 09 18:19:15 <guest355>	got disconnected
Aug 09 18:19:26 <gdm>	ahh, ok
Aug 09 18:19:33 -->	wowi has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:19:40 <pabs>	hi wowi 
Aug 09 18:19:41 <and_>	i think we should wait till 8.30
Aug 09 18:19:47 <guest355>	Damn. Can't find the log in for my name
Aug 09 18:19:58 <wowi>	hi..
Aug 09 18:20:03 <wowi>	is the meeting on?
Aug 09 18:20:23 <wowi>	cos i'm at a dodgy connection and might go elsewhere if i have time
Aug 09 18:20:25 <gdm>	and_ - agree
Aug 09 18:20:26 <and_>	not yet
Aug 09 18:20:32 <and_>	say 8.30
Aug 09 18:20:44 <gdm>	i.e. another 10 mins
Aug 09 18:20:52 <wowi>	how long do i have.. i'm having a simultaneous prospective housemate meeting..
Aug 09 18:20:53 <and_>	oh yeah
Aug 09 18:20:56 <wowi>	and i'm pissing people off
Aug 09 18:21:01 *	and_ is in time warp
Aug 09 18:21:07 -->	quoll has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:21:15 <wowi>	10 mins.
Aug 09 18:21:16 ---	gdm is now known as gdm-afk
Aug 09 18:21:18 <wowi>	dangit..
Aug 09 18:21:22 <wowi>	i'll be late
Aug 09 18:21:24 <guest355>	I am KimCi and kimci and i just got disconnected so I'm back as guest. Can I get that log in thing again. 
Aug 09 18:21:33 ---	wowi is now known as wowi_afk
Aug 09 18:21:46 <--	kimci has quit (Killed (pabs (:)))
Aug 09 18:21:59 <pabs>	guest355: type /nick kimci again
Aug 09 18:22:35 <guest355>	thanks, think help kicked me
Aug 09 18:22:50 ---	guest355 is now known as kimci
Aug 09 18:23:17 ---	and_ is now known as and_gets_dinner
Aug 09 18:24:05 <kimci>	I've been reading the catkore archives and have a fully linked reply if anyone wants a look
Aug 09 18:24:19 <--	quoll has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
Aug 09 18:25:19 <kimci>	Anyone got time for a pre meeting chat. I only know takver in person [housemates]. 
Aug 09 18:29:16 -->	quoll has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:31:15 -->	guest has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:31:41 <pabs>	thats a shocking net connection u have there kim
Aug 09 18:32:00 <--	quoll has quit (Read error: No route to host)
Aug 09 18:33:08 -->	quoll has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:33:28 <quoll>	hello; I'm having trouble with the connection...
Aug 09 18:33:36 <pabs>	hi roman
Aug 09 18:34:02 <quoll>	hopefully this chatzilla client will prove more stable than the tow others....
Aug 09 18:34:33 <zl2tod>	you using a wireless network by any chance ?
Aug 09 18:34:51 <pabs>	u get my email about \A & \Z roman?
Aug 09 18:35:31 <quoll>	no, not wireless, landline. yes pabs, i got the message -- have you some specific examples?
Aug 09 18:35:54 <pabs>	ah, not atm, will dig one up
Aug 09 18:35:55 <quoll>	apologies from doll, who has other commitments tonight
Aug 09 18:36:09 ---	and_gets_dinner is now known as and_
Aug 09 18:36:22 <and_>	anyone else we know that is coming?
Aug 09 18:36:29 ---	gdm-afk is now known as gdm
Aug 09 18:36:39 <pabs>	shane sed yesterday that he was
Aug 09 18:36:57 <pabs>	stacy & andy ??
Aug 09 18:37:02 <gdm>	i thought andycat was coming, but dont see him...
Aug 09 18:37:03 <and_>	maybe peoplecan start by having a look at the agenda
Aug 09 18:37:04 <and_>	http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Local/ImcOceaniaMeeting5
Aug 09 18:37:08 <gdm>	i'll check...
Aug 09 18:37:18 <and_>	and maybe adding anything that needs adding
Aug 09 18:37:38 *	shayne slaps his head at his last email.
Aug 09 18:37:43 <shayne>	Save the tuarts action group.
Aug 09 18:37:55 <shayne>	Someone suggesting getting branding of forest camp with JJJ logos.
Aug 09 18:38:03 *	shayne ready to bite someone.
Aug 09 18:38:03 <and_>	ugh
Aug 09 18:38:30 <shayne>	here
Aug 09 18:39:05 <shayne>	What time was this thing to start.?
Aug 09 18:39:21 <and_>	bout 40 mins ago, maybe we should start
Aug 09 18:39:26 <shayne>	sure
Aug 09 18:39:28 <--	shayne has left #oceania
Aug 09 18:39:30 <quoll>	ok
Aug 09 18:39:32 -->	shayne has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:39:34 <shayne>	doh
Aug 09 18:39:38 ---	wowi_afk is now known as wowi
Aug 09 18:39:48 <and_>	anyone facilitating?
Aug 09 18:40:01 <wowi>	i just want to apologise in advance... i'm going to be in and out of this meeting... 
Aug 09 18:40:14 <wowi>	sorry.. sort of in dual meetings
Aug 09 18:40:23 <shayne>	?
Aug 09 18:40:46 <pabs>	hmm, where's clare n finn?
Aug 09 18:40:53 <gdm>	andycat sends apologies
Aug 09 18:40:54 <and_>	yeah i was just thinking that
Aug 09 18:41:00 <gdm>	he's with his g/f
Aug 09 18:41:31 <and_>	prioirties andy!!!! :)
Aug 09 18:41:39 <shayne>	Ok. Anyway. Agenda items? What do we have?
Aug 09 18:41:48 <and_>	gdm you wanna facilitate?
Aug 09 18:41:55 <and_>	agenda item are here shayne
Aug 09 18:41:57 <and_>	http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Local/ImcOceaniaMeeting5
Aug 09 18:42:08 <and_>	if anyone has anyting to add do it now
Aug 09 18:42:31 <gdm>	nope ;-)
Aug 09 18:42:41 <gdm>	but i guess i could if no-one else wants to
Aug 09 18:42:45 <and_>	:)
Aug 09 18:43:13 <shayne>	do we have any adelaidians around?
Aug 09 18:43:14 -->	theGoatasaguest has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:43:24 <quoll>	 yep
Aug 09 18:43:27 -->	guest658 has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:43:33 <shayne>	quoll=roman?
Aug 09 18:43:36 <gdm>	if we're starting then, does everyone wanna give a quick intro/where they're from??
Aug 09 18:43:39 <quoll>	do yuo want an update?
Aug 09 18:43:40 <guest658>	got disconnected again 
Aug 09 18:43:48 *	and_ imc melbourne
Aug 09 18:43:52 <gdm>	start with and_ ?
Aug 09 18:43:54 <quoll>	quoll=roman!
Aug 09 18:43:57 <gdm>	ok. thx
Aug 09 18:44:14 <guest658>	Anyone know why I keep getting disconnected?
Aug 09 18:44:24 *	gdm i'm in sydney imc and also uk and www-features
Aug 09 18:44:29 <gdm>	pabs?
Aug 09 18:44:50 <pabs>	pabs imc perth, geek
Aug 09 18:44:58 <quoll>	roman in adelaide just back from imc meeting
Aug 09 18:44:59 <gdm>	shayne?
Aug 09 18:45:26 <shayne>	shayne: imc perth
Aug 09 18:45:29 <shayne>	and stuff
Aug 09 18:45:34 <shayne>	process/newimc
Aug 09 18:45:37 *	takver melb & www-features
Aug 09 18:45:52 <gdm>	wowi?
Aug 09 18:46:06 <gdm>	zl2tod?
Aug 09 18:46:19 <wowi>	yes
Aug 09 18:46:33 <shayne>	intros
Aug 09 18:46:37 <wowi>	oops
Aug 09 18:46:41 <wowi>	wowi: imc perth
Aug 09 18:46:49 <theGoatasaguest>	jay observer, imc manila
Aug 09 18:46:54 <RegularFibre>	Trent From Adelaide..
Aug 09 18:47:00 <--	guest has quit (Ping timeout: 600 seconds)
Aug 09 18:47:13 <gdm>	guest658?
Aug 09 18:47:42 -->	guest has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:47:56 <gdm>	guest? can u provide a quick intro pls
Aug 09 18:48:03 <guest>	I am kimci and I am being repeatedly disconnected
Aug 09 18:48:07 <--	gdm has kicked kimci from #oceania (kimci)
Aug 09 18:48:18 <wowi>	?
Aug 09 18:48:23 <--	gdm has kicked guest658 from #oceania (guest658)
Aug 09 18:48:27 <guest>	I am Kim Cosmos from Brisbane Indymedia
Aug 09 18:48:47 <guest>	Nobody there uses IRC abart from me
Aug 09 18:48:47 <shayne>	wowi: ghost client kick. just removing dead clients
Aug 09 18:49:00 <wowi>	ok
Aug 09 18:49:05 <shayne>	er. all on irc. Is it mIRC you are using. or web interface?
Aug 09 18:49:15 <guest>	web interface
Aug 09 18:49:27 <guest>	not at home
Aug 09 18:49:31 <shayne>	ah. probably explains it. yeah. its probably being flakey atm.
Aug 09 18:49:37 <gdm>	me too, guest
Aug 09 18:49:39 <gdm>	it's ok for me
Aug 09 18:49:41 <gdm>	but a bit slow
Aug 09 18:49:47 <guest>	pabs said my connection was poor
Aug 09 18:49:48 <gdm>	anyway, shall we start, then?
Aug 09 18:49:53 <wowi>	yep
Aug 09 18:49:54 <gdm>	and_ are you doing minutes?
Aug 09 18:49:55 <and_>	yep!
Aug 09 18:50:01 <and_>	ahh, really
Aug 09 18:50:02 <gdm>	i see you started the wiki page :-)
Aug 09 18:50:10 <and_>	can't just do logs?
Aug 09 18:50:16 <gdm>	anymore agenda items people??
Aug 09 18:50:18 <pabs>	i can do logs
Aug 09 18:50:21 ---	guest is now known as kimci
Aug 09 18:50:22 <--	kimci has quit (Temporary K-line 1440 min. - You have been banned. Please contact ircd lists indymedia org.  (2004/8/9 03.50))
Aug 09 18:50:29 <shayne>	woak
Aug 09 18:50:30 <pabs>	wtf?
Aug 09 18:50:34 <wowi>	k-line?
Aug 09 18:50:36 <shayne>	woah!
Aug 09 18:50:39 <wowi>	wtf?
Aug 09 18:50:47 <wowi>	..evil
Aug 09 18:50:55 <pabs>	wasn't me
Aug 09 18:50:56 <shayne>	oh dear.
Aug 09 18:51:01 <and_>	wasnt me
Aug 09 18:51:03 <wowi>	neither
Aug 09 18:51:22 <pabs>	it was our spambot killer
Aug 09 18:51:30 <gdm>	ok then: reports back
Aug 09 18:51:31 <pabs>	to many connects
Aug 09 18:51:38 <shayne>	pabs: Can you kill the bot and undo it?
Aug 09 18:51:44 <gdm>	adelaide??
Aug 09 18:51:46 <pabs>	yeah, just did
Aug 09 18:52:09 <quoll>	we had a meeting tonight; confirmed details for sepot 5th relaunch
Aug 09 18:52:15 <and_>	cool
Aug 09 18:52:28 <and_>	you should put a note on the old site quoll
Aug 09 18:52:43 <and_>	it doesn't even mention that the site is undergoing maintenance
Aug 09 18:53:19 <quoll>	we're looking at writing some features & notes on new site tools; there is a note on the old site, seen when you try to publish
Aug 09 18:53:52 <quoll>	we didn't expect the long delay; I'll try and add some more details soonest (as soon as I figure how)
Aug 09 18:54:20 <gdm>	can ppl do <end> when they've finished speaking please?
Aug 09 18:54:49 <quoll>	dave from nomasters is willing to host new site; just waiting to chat to finn about transfer <end>
Aug 09 18:55:00 <zl2tod>	mark here - vaguely related to nz.indy
Aug 09 18:55:05 <gdm>	ok, thanks
Aug 09 18:55:21 <gdm>	can u give us a report back, zl2tod? on aotearoa??
Aug 09 18:55:36 <zl2tod>	not really - finn is in the wilds
Aug 09 18:55:50 <zl2tod>	haven't seen clare for a few days, nor halo
Aug 09 18:56:05 <gdm>	how's the site going?
Aug 09 18:56:11 <zl2tod>	pretty slow
Aug 09 18:56:52 <gdm>	ok, is kimci disconnected again?? no-one else from brissy??
Aug 09 18:57:07 <gdm>	anyone frorm darwin?
Aug 09 18:57:10 <pabs>	nope
Aug 09 18:57:18 <gdm>	jakarta?
Aug 09 18:57:23 <and_>	no
Aug 09 18:57:29 <gdm>	in which case, over to melbourne....
Aug 09 18:57:33 <and_>	umm...
Aug 09 18:57:43 <and_>	not much new..
Aug 09 18:57:56 <and_>	possible concert with kev carmody and other acts in oct
Aug 09 18:58:10 <and_>	all up in the air at the moment
Aug 09 18:58:22 -->	guest has joined #oceania
Aug 09 18:58:28 <guest>	#indymedia 1088818270 You are banned from this server- Temporary K-line 1440 min. - You have been banned. Please contact ircd lists indymedia org.  (2004/8/9 03.50) Error : Closing Link: xxx-xxx-xx-xxx.dyn.iinet.net.au (Temporary K-line 1440 min. - You have been banned. Please contact ircd lists indymedia org.  (2004/8/9 03.50)) Disconnected from irc.indymedia.org 
Aug 09 18:58:32 <and_>	concert in conjunction with other groups such as foe, vpn etc
Aug 09 18:58:46 <guest>	Its  not my connection
Aug 09 18:58:49 <pabs>	guest: too many reconnects in a certain time triggers the bot killer
Aug 09 18:58:52 ---	guest is now known as kimci
Aug 09 18:58:52 <and_>	</end>
Aug 09 18:59:00 <gdm>	kool, thanks and_
Aug 09 18:59:04 <gdm>	takver, anything to add?
Aug 09 18:59:05 <shayne>	guest: malfunctioning bot went spastic. maybe even responsible for disconnects?
Aug 09 18:59:06 <kimci>	I am being disconnected
Aug 09 18:59:28 <gdm>	kimci, quickk report back on brisbane imc??
Aug 09 18:59:47 <kimci>	Can someone querry me and send me a log of the meeting so far?
Aug 09 18:59:59 <gdm>	maybe pabs can help you
Aug 09 19:00:06 <gdm>	we'll come back to you
Aug 09 19:00:07 <pabs>	yep
Aug 09 19:00:13 <gdm>	anyone from manila wanna report back??
Aug 09 19:00:29 <gdm>	theGoatasaguest?
Aug 09 19:00:31 <kimci>	Have I missed agend setting? What topic are we on. Who is facilitating channelop
Aug 09 19:00:38 <theGoatasaguest>	manila imc
Aug 09 19:00:46 <shayne>	kim: we are just getting report backs from each indy.
Aug 09 19:00:50 <shayne>	only done adelaide and melb.
Aug 09 19:00:54 <theGoatasaguest>	and you?
Aug 09 19:01:06 <shayne>	goat: Whats happening in manila atm?
Aug 09 19:02:03 <theGoatasaguest>	the usual problems of not having equipments to update the site, plus money probs. 
Aug 09 19:02:11 <pabs>	kimci: see the topic
Aug 09 19:02:35 <gdm>	is there much contact with qc at all?
Aug 09 19:03:37 <gdm>	take that as a no ;-)
Aug 09 19:03:53 <kimci>	We have an identity pirate here
Aug 09 19:03:54 <gdm>	ok, perth: report back??
Aug 09 19:03:56 <theGoatasaguest>	seldom, last fri. i made a angst filled email on matters such as too mush generalization of qc on barriers on relationship between oceania and asian imc'c
Aug 09 19:04:01 <wowi>	may i?
Aug 09 19:04:03 <gdm>	sorry!
Aug 09 19:04:22 <wowi>	sorry too.
Aug 09 19:04:29 <kimci>	I can only get the channel as a feed so I have to reply in a seperate web window
Aug 09 19:04:33 <theGoatasaguest>	much rather i mean.
Aug 09 19:04:34 <wowi>	email to who?
Aug 09 19:04:44 <theGoatasaguest>	to alex
Aug 09 19:04:54 <wowi>	ok.. any response
Aug 09 19:04:59 <kimci>	I am Kimci, KimCi kimci and kimcosmos
Aug 09 19:05:23 <gdm>	kimci, we realise that, please can u stop interrupting 
Aug 09 19:05:26 <shayne>	kim: we are only seeing you atm. relax.
Aug 09 19:05:32 <gdm>	u can speak in a minute
Aug 09 19:05:35 <wowi>	is he the only person you've talked to in QC about that?
Aug 09 19:05:52 <zl2tod>	shall we elect a chairman, or will we continue to allow gdm to elect himself ?
Aug 09 19:06:01 <kimci>	is the topic in the current log?
Aug 09 19:06:02 <wowi>	i elect gdm
Aug 09 19:06:08 <theGoatasaguest>	about the proposal of an ala-oceania network.non so far...i am really pissed on how they handled things on networking, we were the nearest imc yet they never informed us on those proposals
Aug 09 19:06:12 <gdm>	zl2tod: someone else suggested me, i didn't volunteer
Aug 09 19:06:27 *	shayne seconds gdm then
Aug 09 19:06:45 <theGoatasaguest>	who's gdm?
Aug 09 19:06:51 <wowi>	did they respond to that goat?
Aug 09 19:07:01 <shayne>	gdm is GarcoDuMonde: syd imc.
Aug 09 19:07:05 <kimci>	Paps I need you to listen to query channel to me because no-one else can see what i say in that channel window
Aug 09 19:07:06 *	gdm garcondumonde, sydney imc also www-features and uk-imc
Aug 09 19:07:28 <theGoatasaguest>	nope. not yet, i do hope though, it's just a question of sincerity and democratic processes
Aug 09 19:07:39 <theGoatasaguest>	ah ok, thanks gdm!!
Aug 09 19:07:53 <wowi>	but only alex.. did you cc to the qc-list
Aug 09 19:08:34 <gdm>	is it holidays further north?? 
Aug 09 19:08:52 <wowi>	gdm:?
Aug 09 19:09:27 <gdm>	like, a lot of ppl in europe are on summer holiday, so away from computers/indymedia. is it the same in asian imcs further north of oceania region??
Aug 09 19:09:50 <gdm>	does this affect lack of response to theGoatasaguest?
Aug 09 19:10:07 <wowi>	he emailed qc.. it's 30mins away
Aug 09 19:10:21 <gdm>	sorry, then: misunderstood
Aug 09 19:10:28 <wowi>	no worries :)
Aug 09 19:10:38 <gdm>	theGoatasaguest: any more to add or shalll we move on to perth?
Aug 09 19:10:46 <wowi>	goat.. to clarify... ala-opceania network is?
Aug 09 19:13:09 <gdm>	theGoatasaguest?
Aug 09 19:13:39 <wowi>	perhaps we should talk about this further after report backs.. asia networks is an sgenda item
Aug 09 19:13:45 <and_>	can we keep going with perth for the moent or something
Aug 09 19:13:47 <theGoatasaguest>	nope i don't thinks so cause as far as i know qc has better, easier access to pcs than us. and it's not vacation time here
Aug 09 19:14:04 <gdm>	ok
Aug 09 19:14:10 <gdm>	perth - u wanna report back?
Aug 09 19:14:21 <shayne>	Ok
Aug 09 19:14:21 <wowi>	yup
Aug 09 19:14:21 <and_>	it's only been 4 days theGoatasaguest though?
Aug 09 19:14:28 <wowi>	shayne: may i?
Aug 09 19:14:29 <theGoatasaguest>	asian imc network...he says that it's a proposal he mentioned on the conference
Aug 09 19:14:29 <shayne>	wowi: u fisrt
Aug 09 19:14:37 <wowi>	ok cool :)
Aug 09 19:14:52 <gdm>	theGoatasaguest we'll come back to asia-pacific
Aug 09 19:15:03 <wowi>	we're doing a fundraiser screening of 'the take' 
Aug 09 19:15:09 <theGoatasaguest>	yeah i know, but has anyone read the email/invite of alex to japan
Aug 09 19:15:09 *	and_ shuts up, was gunna say what gdm said
Aug 09 19:15:18 <wowi>	it's mutual aid with the beginnings of food not bombs
Aug 09 19:15:29 <wowi>	like co fundriasing
Aug 09 19:15:34 <and_>	yeah, we have read it, there is a whole topic on asia-pacific netowrk
Aug 09 19:15:47 <and_>	can you wait till then theGoatasaguest?
Aug 09 19:15:56 <wowi>	some newsreel stuff beginning
Aug 09 19:16:19 <wowi>	a doco... and hopefully a video making meeting.. cos i keep finding interested people
Aug 09 19:16:31 <gdm>	kool!
Aug 09 19:16:41 <wowi>	we have been offered 6wks 1hr/wk air time from ch31
Aug 09 19:16:44 <theGoatasaguest>	and i am not comfortable with the process since building a network on the premise that we asians were having difficulty, in terms of geo-cultural gap?
Aug 09 19:16:48 <theGoatasaguest>	absurd
Aug 09 19:16:56 <wowi>	we need to fill it some how.. i'll contact ska and more
Aug 09 19:17:15 <theGoatasaguest>	ok i'll wait
Aug 09 19:17:23 <theGoatasaguest>	thanks for the space
Aug 09 19:17:26 <--	kimci has quit (Ping timeout: 600 seconds)
Aug 09 19:17:32 <wowi>	goat: i wanna talk about that stuff.. dont worry it'll happen
Aug 09 19:17:45 <shayne>	wowi. may I now?
Aug 09 19:18:00 <wowi>	yup.. i'll just check my minutes whi9le you go
Aug 09 19:18:06 <shayne>	Ok.
Aug 09 19:18:30 <shayne>	The other big development in perth is a degree of renewed interest in the site from mainstream journos
Aug 09 19:18:53 <shayne>	over the whole story about the nazis harassing us
Aug 09 19:19:06 <shayne>	the cops did mass arrests over last few weeks of neo nazis
Aug 09 19:19:23 <shayne>	and it seems that evidence that folks posted on perth indy suggests purgery
Aug 09 19:19:28 <wowi>	our trolls :)
Aug 09 19:19:40 <shayne>	so it seems that the indy community is finally getting its vengance in perth
Aug 09 19:19:51 <shayne>	which is kinda nice
Aug 09 19:20:33 <shayne>	er. over.
Aug 09 19:20:51 <shayne>	<end>
Aug 09 19:20:55 <shayne>	<yeah yeah>
Aug 09 19:20:58 <gdm>	ok,
Aug 09 19:21:03 <gdm>	anyone from qc??
Aug 09 19:21:13 <gdm>	otherwise i'll do sydney quickly....
Aug 09 19:21:14 <wowi>	i have some things to report back that aren't perth!
Aug 09 19:21:26 <gdm>	go on then
Aug 09 19:21:27 <wowi>	do i leave them to relevant topics?
Aug 09 19:21:39 <gdm>	depends if they are report back or discussion?
Aug 09 19:22:14 <shayne>	its a local report back on global issues if its what I think it is.
Aug 09 19:22:15 <wowi>	hrm.. i'll save it till asia stuff.. but.. perth is making merchandise.. that includes undies :)
Aug 09 19:22:30 <gdm>	lol
Aug 09 19:22:30 <wowi>	<end>
Aug 09 19:22:43 <gdm>	ok, sydney: we have got the black cat room going
Aug 09 19:22:56 <gdm>	is a room with computers etc in town that is shared with cat
Aug 09 19:23:01 <gdm>	used by imc on thursday nights
Aug 09 19:23:07 <gdm>	we're doing workshops
Aug 09 19:23:15 <gdm>	and thinking of how to get people involved
Aug 09 19:23:38 <gdm>	we haven't had a meeting yet since the conference, but got one i think tomorrow but maybe next week
Aug 09 19:23:45 <gdm>	[i need to check!]
Aug 09 19:23:53 <gdm>	several new ppl should come
Aug 09 19:23:57 <gdm>	so it's all good :-)
Aug 09 19:23:59 <gdm>	<end>
Aug 09 19:24:16 <gdm>	finally, anyone from tokelau?
Aug 09 19:24:23 <pabs>	haha
Aug 09 19:24:26 <and_>	:)
Aug 09 19:24:35 <gdm>	otherwise, onto site updates from adelaide
Aug 09 19:24:44 <shayne>	I hear all is fine in tokelau still :)
Aug 09 19:24:54 <gdm>	quoll - u wanna repeat what u said earlier, for the record?
Aug 09 19:25:03 -->	zl2test has joined #oceania
Aug 09 19:25:43 <gdm>	actually, did kimci wanna say anything about brisbane, as areport back??
Aug 09 19:25:47 <quoll>	 OK: plans advanced for site relaunch on sept 5th; venue, DJ, band booked; 2 features selected for screening.
Aug 09 19:26:08 <gdm>	we're gonna discuss it properly tho, later
Aug 09 19:26:22 -->	shayneguest has joined #oceania
Aug 09 19:26:26 <gdm>	mebbe after quoll finishes (sorry for interrupting)
Aug 09 19:26:57 <quoll>	2 new people want to get involved (yay!) and we've cleened up the imc adelaide mailing list. leaflets will be distributed this fri,
Aug 09 19:27:26 <quoll>	so we need to work on finishing the site & preparing intro to new features <end>
Aug 09 19:27:27 <--	shayneguest has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
Aug 09 19:27:41 <gdm>	excellent
Aug 09 19:28:22 <gdm>	any discussion from anyone (seems kimci crashed and burned again in terms of connection)
Aug 09 19:28:50 <and_>	does adelaide have rss ready for inclusion in oceania?
Aug 09 19:29:26 <zl2tod>	and on a related note, there was some talk of nz.indy's syndication not working
Aug 09 19:29:35 <pabs>	cron was down
Aug 09 19:29:40 <and_>	oceania site is next topic
Aug 09 19:29:43 <zl2tod>	ahh - cool
Aug 09 19:29:46 <gdm>	yup
Aug 09 19:29:53 <quoll>	hmmm I presume dada genrates same; we're not online again yet, but will have rss feeds for newswire & features, even if I have to write them myself! 
Aug 09 19:30:17 <pabs>	dada can do them
Aug 09 19:30:29 <pabs>	features and newswire
Aug 09 19:30:32 <quoll>	suspected it could ;_0
Aug 09 19:30:32 <wowi>	i'm gunna make a dash for another comp location (i'm at a mates) i'll be back intime for asia stuff.. 10mins,  pls wait
Aug 09 19:30:36 <wowi>	cyas!
Aug 09 19:30:40 <--	wowi has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
Aug 09 19:31:09 <shayne>	[OT] I've just emailed kimci asking for a reportback by email on brisbane. I said I'll fwd it to the meeting.
Aug 09 19:31:17 <gdm>	thx
Aug 09 19:31:27 <gdm>	ok, onto oceania?
Aug 09 19:31:30 <and_>	yep
Aug 09 19:31:33 <shayne>	nods
Aug 09 19:31:37 <quoll>	ok
Aug 09 19:31:54 <gdm>	zl2tod: u wanna speak?
Aug 09 19:32:35 <and_>	i propose we extend the length of features to first paragraph break a la http://oceania.indymedia.org/test.php
Aug 09 19:32:44 <and_>	sorry to but in
Aug 09 19:33:37 <zl2tod>	nothing to add that I can think of atm
Aug 09 19:33:47 <gdm>	ok,
Aug 09 19:33:51 <gdm>	carry on and_ ?
Aug 09 19:33:57 <and_>	that's it
Aug 09 19:34:02 <and_>	what do people think
Aug 09 19:34:07 <and_>	it's much easier to read
Aug 09 19:34:25 <gdm>	i like it :-)
Aug 09 19:34:40 <and_>	at the moment it breaks before the end of the first sentence often
Aug 09 19:35:32 <and_>	any dissent?
Aug 09 19:36:08 <and_>	i think the other problem is that bris and syd don't put out long rss right pabs?
Aug 09 19:36:17 <and_>	so are not included at the moment
Aug 09 19:36:25 <pabs>	as far as i know, thats right
Aug 09 19:36:34 <and_>	gdm: can you get syders people onto that
Aug 09 19:36:35 <pabs>	andy knows the software better tho
Aug 09 19:36:59 <and_>	if andy is doing it for syd it might not be that much more work to do it for bris
Aug 09 19:37:45 <gdm>	yes: i'll bring it up at the netx meeting
Aug 09 19:37:51 <and_>	ok
Aug 09 19:37:59 <and_>	we still don't have an oceania gif
Aug 09 19:38:09 <and_>	there should be one on every site
Aug 09 19:38:18 <and_>	i am hassling graphic design friend to make one soon
Aug 09 19:38:21 <gdm>	yeah, i think we need to improve on that pirate image ;-)
Aug 09 19:38:24 <gdm>	great as it is
Aug 09 19:38:30 <and_>	yeah, i agree
Aug 09 19:38:30 *	pabs like the pirate
Aug 09 19:38:44 -->	guest has joined #oceania
Aug 09 19:38:47 <guest>	-deuterium.pa.us.ircchat.tk- *** Your hostmask is Kimci!~kimci@xxx-xxx-xx-xxx.dyn.iinet.net.au  -
Aug 09 19:38:49 *	and_ like the pirate but it's not for everybody
Aug 09 19:39:10 <and_>	some people don't even have a text link on their site to oceania
Aug 09 19:39:26 <gdm>	who?
Aug 09 19:39:44 <and_>	i think nz doesn't
Aug 09 19:39:52 <pabs>	and perth
Aug 09 19:40:19 <guest>	autokills mirc connection if nick is kimci
Aug 09 19:40:26 <and_>	they have one but it's right down the bottom as part of the cities list on nz
Aug 09 19:40:36 <and_>	unless i am missing something which is possivle
Aug 09 19:40:43 <and_>	anyway, something to go into minutes
Aug 09 19:40:58 <and_>	is there any other stuff from conference that needs following up?
Aug 09 19:41:04 <and_>	people saw all the finance stuff etc.
Aug 09 19:41:11 <and_>	be good if more people wrote feedback
Aug 09 19:41:18 <and_>	only 4 or 5 people did
Aug 09 19:41:22 <gdm>	and_ everyone should have the same copy of the cities list, so all should have that link to oceania
Aug 09 19:41:32 <gdm>	and_ getting OT, me thinks
Aug 09 19:41:48 <and_>	they have a dif one so it is right down the bottom but i think it should be more prominetn anyway
Aug 09 19:41:48 <theGoatasaguest>	yeah, i wanted to know if those imc that weren;t able to attend
Aug 09 19:41:52 <and_>	getting OT?
Aug 09 19:41:52 <gdm>	lets finish oceania.indy
Aug 09 19:42:06 <guest>	hey I did't get to report yet
Aug 09 19:42:09 <and_>	off topic
Aug 09 19:42:18 <guest>	whats the topic?
Aug 09 19:42:19 <and_>	i get it
Aug 09 19:42:32 <and_>	topic is oceania site, i was talking to gdm kimci
Aug 09 19:42:54 <guest>	Can I have an agenda list please
Aug 09 19:43:04 <gdm>	http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Local/ImcOceaniaMeeting5
Aug 09 19:43:08 <and_>	brisbane is on the agenda
Aug 09 19:43:14 ---	gdm has changed the topic to: http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Local/ImcOceaniaMeeting5
Aug 09 19:43:33 <guest>	no a current agenda. I am kimci and ain't got nothing yet
Aug 09 19:43:44 <gdm>	anyone else have comments on the image?
Aug 09 19:43:44 <and_>	the topic is the oceania site
Aug 09 19:43:55 <zl2tod>	kimci: the agenda is at http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Local/ImcOceaniaMeeting5
Aug 09 19:44:00 <gdm>	adelaide peeps??
Aug 09 19:44:07 <gdm>	manila?
Aug 09 19:44:14 <and_>	what image gdm>
Aug 09 19:44:15 <and_>	?
Aug 09 19:44:37 <gdm>	u said u were trying to get an oceania gif
Aug 09 19:44:42 <and_>	oh, ok
Aug 09 19:45:01 <guest>	OK can I request an out of sequence report after this topic please. Warbot victim. report
Aug 09 19:45:22 <and_>	it'll be small, half that of the newsreal logo say
Aug 09 19:45:48 *	and_ is happy to do brisbane next
Aug 09 19:45:57 <gdm>	kimci: yes
Aug 09 19:46:10 <and_>	are we finished with oceania site?
Aug 09 19:46:12 <and_>	pabs?
Aug 09 19:46:23 <guest>	Report then discussion
Aug 09 19:46:43 <pabs>	roman just gave me a cool regex - the oceania test thing can go live now
Aug 09 19:46:44 <gdm>	report now; i think discussion should wait til wowi is back
Aug 09 19:46:55 <gdm>	carry on pabs
Aug 09 19:47:02 <pabs>	<end>
Aug 09 19:47:05 <pabs>	:)
Aug 09 19:47:28 <gdm>	ok, anyone else comments on oceania??
Aug 09 19:47:46 -->	wowi has joined #oceania
Aug 09 19:47:47 <guest>	RSS feeds. The standardised query interface?
Aug 09 19:48:07 <shayne>	?
Aug 09 19:48:23 <quoll>	I'll try and produce an exampole in dada RSN
Aug 09 19:48:42 <gdm>	can u expand, guest?
Aug 09 19:48:43 <pabs>	i think that query thing can wait till a tech meeting
Aug 09 19:50:00 <theGoatasaguest>	ah personally i like the pirate one..though if bothers visitors, ah, might as well change it, that is if it bothers them.
Aug 09 19:50:13 <gdm>	[that's in reference to the image]
Aug 09 19:50:29 <theGoatasaguest>	yeah.
Aug 09 19:51:08 <guest>	Someone suggested a standardised query probably in XML. Standardised RSS field names would make that more solid
Aug 09 19:52:08 <shayne>	XML with dublin core bits in--> Rss out -->
Aug 09 19:52:18 <shayne>	buzzwords all around.
Aug 09 19:52:19 <gdm>	ok, shall we move onto brisbane?
Aug 09 19:52:26 <and_>	what ever happens with gif i'll send to list first in anycase for feedback
Aug 09 19:52:31 <gdm>	maybe that stuff is more appropriate for a tech meet
Aug 09 19:52:31 <guest>	eschew obfuscation I say
Aug 09 19:52:36 <and_>	nothhing even made yet
Aug 09 19:52:36 <gdm>	kool: thanks and_
Aug 09 19:52:42 <guest>	Miss any decisions?
Aug 09 19:52:47 <shayne>	no
Aug 09 19:52:49 <gdm>	nope
Aug 09 19:52:52 <theGoatasaguest>	ah sorry about the piraty thing must have mixed it up, the site good  and ey ok to me
Aug 09 19:52:55 <guest>	cool
Aug 09 19:53:08 <gdm>	no, thanks for contributions goat :-)
Aug 09 19:53:21 <gdm>	guest: u wanna give a report back first and then we'll discuss?
Aug 09 19:53:28 <gdm>	guest/kimci?
Aug 09 19:54:16 <guest>	OK
Aug 09 19:54:35 <guest>	Yes I am Kimci. BIMC report?
Aug 09 19:54:41 <gdm>	yes please
Aug 09 19:54:51 *	pabs bbiab - dinner
Aug 09 19:55:24 <guest>	The library is going well. 7 at last meeting
Aug 09 19:55:59 <guest>	Kill Your TV [an allied offshoot had 34]
Aug 09 19:56:16 <guest>	The last resource collective had 5 people
Aug 09 19:56:58 <guest>	WE currently have 13 full members. (attending 2 of last 4) subgroup or genertal meetings)
Aug 09 19:57:26 <guest>	Looks like First mediation Friday 
Aug 09 19:57:31 <and_>	34 what sorry?
Aug 09 19:57:42 <shayne>	KimK said she's up for it too yeah?
Aug 09 19:57:45 <shayne>	(thats positive!)
Aug 09 19:57:50 <gdm>	34 at last meeting, i take it!
Aug 09 19:57:57 <shayne>	Whos doing the mediation?
Aug 09 19:58:08 <gdm>	shayne: wait for kimci to finish report
Aug 09 19:58:12 <gdm>	please
Aug 09 19:58:17 <shayne>	sorry
Aug 09 19:58:19 <guest>	The Resource room vid editor has VHS, 3 mons, DVD burner, 
Aug 09 19:58:54 <guest>	Cable booked recording is being planned
Aug 09 19:59:14 <guest>	Library wiki site is up on IMC one
Aug 09 19:59:32 <guest>	All minutes and standing agreements are there too.
Aug 09 19:59:37 <guest>	door
Aug 09 20:00:33 <and_>	was it 34 people at last meeting kimci for KYTV?
Aug 09 20:00:41 <guest>	I have made a linked list of all catkore emails relating to BIMC to show the password was never discussed there when Andy changed it the first time.
Aug 09 20:01:01 <guest>	I will be publishing that with a commentry.
Aug 09 20:01:38 <gdm>	kool; will have a look at it
Aug 09 20:01:43 <guest>	GDM told the process list there was Brisbane representative at the Oceania conference.
Aug 09 20:02:24 <guest>	Tim split from BIMC 18 months ago and didn't tell anyone he was going to the conference [any lists or me
Aug 09 20:02:39 *	shayne scratches his chin.
Aug 09 20:02:40 <gdm>	clarification: no i did not
Aug 09 20:02:50 <guest>	I can put it up on a wiki now if you'd like
Aug 09 20:02:59 <and_>	tim was dragged to the conference, he was not planning on attending
Aug 09 20:03:16 <guest>	Haven't got the quote in front of me. I will post it to the oceania list
Aug 09 20:03:19 <wowi>	i've read that in posts which are now on the wiki from my understanding
Aug 09 20:03:24 <guest>	I am not at home
Aug 09 20:03:32 <wowi>	that Tim was found at RTS.
Aug 09 20:03:36 <wowi>	lemme check too.
Aug 09 20:03:43 <gdm>	http://lists.indymedia.org/pipermail/imc-process/2004-July/0726-ud.html
Aug 09 20:03:57 <gdm>	is the post. i said that bris were unable to send representatives
Aug 09 20:04:09 <guest>	the wiki does not say there was a BIMC rep there I think
Aug 09 20:04:12 <gdm>	to the conference
Aug 09 20:04:15 <guest>	just a member
Aug 09 20:04:16 <gdm>	1st paragraph
Aug 09 20:04:38 <gdm>	the statement from conference states there was a former member of bris imc
Aug 09 20:04:59 <shayne>	guest: I think it was clear that the person was a former member that was just putting forth an opinion on the matter.
Aug 09 20:05:02 <guest>	and the email to process? got your email client handy?
Aug 09 20:05:19 <shayne>	For what its worth, I dont think he was comfortable with the oceania proposal (from my observation)
Aug 09 20:06:08 <gdm>	he wasn't there when we went thru the proposal, shayne
Aug 09 20:06:14 <and_>	umm, oceania hadn't come up with A proposal when tim was there, only discussed options shayne
Aug 09 20:06:18 <wowi>	i didn't necessarily get that shayne.. he left before the discussion finalised
Aug 09 20:06:21 <guest>	So, on the testimony of a former member, KimK and Asger's queries to oceania and only 3 emails from CAT we get taken over
Aug 09 20:06:26 -->	doll has joined #oceania
Aug 09 20:06:51 <quoll>	  /msg doll hello! you're just in time for a bun-fight
Aug 09 20:06:53 <and_>	and about 50 emails to the oceania list proving how disfuncitonal brisbane was kimci
Aug 09 20:06:57 <guest>	Linda asked CAT before the oceania meeting not to change the passwords
Aug 09 20:07:02 <wowi>	there was much debate and it was agreed that it shouldn't be a takeober
Aug 09 20:07:18 <gdm>	kimci: i think it is more benefiical to focus on mediation or how to restore a funcitonal collective again now
Aug 09 20:07:24 <gdm>	rather than go over old ground
Aug 09 20:07:31 <wowi>	but intermediory role cos of cats feelings
Aug 09 20:07:33 <gdm>	have u anything constructive to suggest?
Aug 09 20:07:34 <guest>	Mediation was announced 12 days before the oceania conference to the oceania list
Aug 09 20:07:39 *	doll waves 2 all and lissens quietly
Aug 09 20:07:50 *	and_ wave to doll
Aug 09 20:07:51 *	wowi waves at doll
Aug 09 20:08:01 <guest>	We have a local federation of groups. Editorial is one of those. You did not ask...
Aug 09 20:08:01 *	doll :-)
Aug 09 20:08:04 *	shayne waves at doll
Aug 09 20:08:37 <wowi>	kim: where would you like it to go from hear?
Aug 09 20:08:43 <wowi>	*here
Aug 09 20:08:55 <guest>	We have a conflict resolution procedure which I sent to the oceania list and is on our wiki site and the mediation showed we were progressing on it.
Aug 09 20:09:20 <gdm>	guest/kimci: have u anything constructive to suggest now?
Aug 09 20:09:32 <gdm>	like, what about hte prospects for fridays mediation session?
Aug 09 20:09:36 <shayne>	I think the problem that was identified, was that there wasnt signs that the mediation was mutual.
Aug 09 20:09:36 <guest>	The step after that of challenging membership or password holding would be decided at our next federal meeting
Aug 09 20:09:47 <gdm>	can the oceania network provide any more support at themoment for brisbane?
Aug 09 20:10:03 <guest>	OK, maybe KimK has finally agreed because of your drastic action.
Aug 09 20:10:04 <and_>	when is the next meeting?
Aug 09 20:10:10 <shayne>	;) 
Aug 09 20:10:39 <and_>	or sorry, when is the next federal meeting
Aug 09 20:10:43 <and_>	the big one
Aug 09 20:11:01 <guest>	Saturday is quick general meeting after mediation to get site back. Bigger meeting in 30 days
Aug 09 20:11:17 <and_>	ok
Aug 09 20:11:22 <gdm>	does everyone know about the saturday meeting?
Aug 09 20:11:31 <gdm>	do u wanna propose a feature to announce it?
Aug 09 20:12:03 <and_>	I propose that oceania network fund an non brisbane person to go to brisbane to attend the meeting in 30 days
Aug 09 20:12:28 <and_>	as an observer
Aug 09 20:12:33 <guest>	Reports of moderators on our site not following our hiding posts policies, particularly the notice provisions
Aug 09 20:12:37 <shayne>	Can I ammend that proposal such that the person should be someone trusted by all parties to the situation.
Aug 09 20:12:50 <quoll>	can I ask for clarification of the sat meeting, is this of the 13 members of BIMC?
Aug 09 20:12:57 <guest>	I have noticed lazy pulling of whole posts rather than porn comments recently
Aug 09 20:13:02 <and_>	people don't know people shayne, trust might be the wrong word
Aug 09 20:13:16 <--	zl2test has quit (Ping timeout: 600 seconds)
Aug 09 20:13:31 <guest>	BIMC can only participate in the admin list through archives
Aug 09 20:13:47 <and_>	independent might bea better word
Aug 09 20:13:48 <gdm>	nope, BIMC can post to the list, too
Aug 09 20:13:51 <shayne>	or perhaps rather that we send someone who is not DIStrusted by either 'side', and perhaps even a little removed from the core oceania group.
Aug 09 20:13:55 <guest>	I need 5 min. End Report is OK. Gerry getting his files.
Aug 09 20:14:06 <--	zl2tod has quit (Ping timeout: 600 seconds)
Aug 09 20:14:07 <shayne>	ok
Aug 09 20:14:08 <theGoatasaguest>	need to go now!! cya around 
Aug 09 20:14:12 <gdm>	ok, do u want us to come back to this, kimci?
Aug 09 20:14:21 <and_>	i think they should be part ofthe core oceania group and have a knowledge of what is going on
Aug 09 20:14:26 <shayne>	goat: We'll try and post minutes to manila list
Aug 09 20:14:37 <and_>	sorry to not get to you goat
Aug 09 20:14:47 <gdm>	ahhh goat - before u go: anything more to say on asia-pacific???
Aug 09 20:14:53 <and_>	perhpas we can put of asia-pacific discussion to later date?
Aug 09 20:15:28 *	shayne seconds that if Goat cant be here.
Aug 09 20:15:46 <gdm>	maybe send email to imc-oceania lists cat org au please theGoatasaguest with your thoughts?
Aug 09 20:15:47 <quoll>	suggest we make it first item on next meeting; and that we all post summaryu/reports on wiki a day before the meeting, so we can get down to Q&A
Aug 09 20:15:59 <gdm>	any disagreement?
Aug 09 20:16:05 <shayne>	I also suggest we discuss it on list.
Aug 09 20:16:12 <quoll>	fine.
Aug 09 20:16:18 <gdm>	yes
Aug 09 20:17:23 <guest>	I'm back
Aug 09 20:17:31 <quoll>	If BIMC reaches consensus at Sat meeting as to who has "keys", is there any reason we need to send someone up theree in 30 days?
Aug 09 20:18:08 <guest>	I am still waiting on the tech list password that was supposed to be emailed to me 2 months ago
Aug 09 20:18:38 <guest>	We are likely to ask for mediation with Andy at least
Aug 09 20:19:03 <quoll>	Are all parties happy with Andy as mediator?
Aug 09 20:19:08 <gdm>	andy cat?
Aug 09 20:19:10 <and_>	quoll, i don't trust anyone in this debate and would feel reassured if an independent person the oceania network strusts was sent
Aug 09 20:19:27 <gdm>	and, him as a mediator, or mediation _with_ him?
Aug 09 20:19:34 <guest>	Can the mediation funds be spent on that as it is long out standing dispute of CAT not recording reasons fro site root password change anywhere
Aug 09 20:20:42 <and_>	sent to observe everything is above board that is
Aug 09 20:21:06 <and_>	given how much minutes are disputed in brisbane
Aug 09 20:21:15 <theGoatasaguest>	comrades need to go now, kinda hungry. i'll just keep in touch....is there anyway that i could get the minutes of this meeting via email?
Aug 09 20:21:17 <guest>	Andy and CAT are refusing to discuss it apart for a 3 word apology fro mistake. It was changed for a friend for a member who was leaving to move to Sydney and Andy gave it to KimK. Andy refuses to give of his correspondence on it at all as does Barry and KimK
Aug 09 20:22:06 <shayne>	later goat. 
Aug 09 20:22:11 <shayne>	yeah. We'll send you the minutes.
Aug 09 20:22:15 <guest>	This is a standard accounting procedure as a CAT breach of its charter in changing it and also in refusing to explain it at all.
Aug 09 20:22:16 <quoll>	 bye goat
Aug 09 20:22:40 <gdm>	kimci: oceania can't really help solve your probs with andy (cat). but we can help resolve the problems WITHIN the bris. imc collective
Aug 09 20:22:42 <and_>	does bimc need mediation with cat or do you kimci?
Aug 09 20:22:45 <theGoatasaguest>	bye everyone!!! thanks for the space!! FREEDOM!!!
Aug 09 20:22:47 <gdm>	can we focus on that pleasae
Aug 09 20:23:08 <guest>	OK I'm foreshadowing a request for mediation funds with CAT on that
Aug 09 20:23:49 <wowi>	goat: do you want to talk about asia network stuff over email?
Aug 09 20:24:33 <and_>	oceania funds are for mediation for indymedia, not cat, especially as it sounds like it is not BIMC that need mediation with cat but *some* brisbane imc members 
Aug 09 20:24:39 <guest>	I'm done. Asia Pacific Network next?
Aug 09 20:24:52 <gdm>	well said and_
Aug 09 20:25:05 <gdm>	guest/kimci there are lots of issues remaining i think on BIMC
Aug 09 20:25:09 <wowi>	goat: i'll talk to you on manila-imc list.
Aug 09 20:25:13 <theGoatasaguest>	ok ill talk now
Aug 09 20:25:15 <guest>	Cat owns our indymedia.org subdomains
Aug 09 20:25:19 <wowi>	cool
Aug 09 20:25:20 <and_>	what do people think of the proposal of sending a delegate?
Aug 09 20:25:22 <wowi>	:)
Aug 09 20:25:34 <wowi>	why?
Aug 09 20:25:35 <and_>	shall we put it to the list for more discussion?
Aug 09 20:25:54 <and_>	why send a oceania delegate wowi?
Aug 09 20:26:02 <theGoatasaguest>	are we now goign to talk about the asia network(?)
Aug 09 20:26:02 <wowi>	what would that serve.. put it to the list tho.. i'm interested in discussion on it
Aug 09 20:26:03 <quoll>	Can we clarify the meeting on saturday; ios this of the 13 BIMC mmeners?
Aug 09 20:26:09 <wowi>	and_: yup
Aug 09 20:26:22 <wowi>	goat: very soon
Aug 09 20:26:39 <and_>	given the disputes around brisbane indymedia minutes it might be useful
Aug 09 20:26:58 <and_>	alternatively we could ask a known independent person from brisbane to go to themeeting and take minutes
Aug 09 20:26:59 <wowi>	how so.. are they there to talk on behalf or to just watch
Aug 09 20:27:11 <wowi>	that makes more sense
Aug 09 20:27:18 <guest>	yep, all 13 have been told through all our organising list and will get direct emails tonight for ones that have unsubbed
Aug 09 20:27:18 <wowi>	or record and stream.
Aug 09 20:27:21 <and_>	yeah, ok, i detract my proposal
Aug 09 20:27:38 <guest>	Why?
Aug 09 20:27:51 <and_>	and change it to "that there will be an independent minute taker at the meeting"
Aug 09 20:27:54 <wowi>	well it's worth discussion on the list.. both shayne and sean have suggestted the same thins
Aug 09 20:28:05 <guest>	sorry OT
Aug 09 20:28:17 <and_>	because brisbane can't agree on what is or isn't in it's minutes kimci/guest
Aug 09 20:28:32 <wowi>	..who picks this minuter?
Aug 09 20:28:39 <quoll>	Would brisbane want an "outsider" present as observer?
Aug 09 20:28:42 <gdm>	guest: can u cc that email to imc-oceania please?
Aug 09 20:28:56 <gdm>	i don't think we need an independent person at the meeting
Aug 09 20:29:03 <gdm>	as long as all parties agree on the minutes
Aug 09 20:29:07 <guest>	the oceania list can send a delegate
Aug 09 20:29:14 <gdm>	i trust them to be able to tell us whether they agree or not
Aug 09 20:29:28 <guest>	See thats why I like IRC. everybody minutes
Aug 09 20:29:29 <gdm>	if they don't agree, then maybe send a independent person to the one in 30 days time
Aug 09 20:29:54 <and_>	video streaming? :)
Aug 09 20:29:56 <and_>	haha
Aug 09 20:29:59 <and_>	court tv ;)
Aug 09 20:30:05 <wowi>	audio streaming tho.
Aug 09 20:30:05 <gdm>	guest: maybe you need to organise training sessions so some of the other members feel more confident with irc
Aug 09 20:30:20 <gdm>	then, some of these problems may not arise in the future
Aug 09 20:30:32 <wowi>	oh irc.. ok.. dont you think face to face is better?
Aug 09 20:30:44 <--	theGoatasaguest has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
Aug 09 20:30:51 *	and_ thinks face to face is better
Aug 09 20:31:14 <gdm>	yes, f2f is def better
Aug 09 20:31:17 <guest>	There is agreement on what is in those minutes because KimK emailed that she expected me to dispute them. I.e. she knew she was not minuting consensus. That will be withdrawn and maybe we'll agrre on a minutes but nothing was decided so they would be short
Aug 09 20:31:24 <wowi>	irc leaves room for misunderstanding.
Aug 09 20:32:01 *	and_ wonders where to go from here..
Aug 09 20:32:24 -->	zl2tod has joined #oceania
Aug 09 20:32:25 <quoll>	Suggest we await outcome of first mediation & the sat meeting
Aug 09 20:32:31 <gdm>	quoll: u had some questions/thoughts about brisbane....
Aug 09 20:32:50 <guest>	We did agree that posts were hidden that none of us hid so the current password holders all say it wasn't them, So the new password should go to all the people present at that meeting plus Danni as we are all the formally documented
Aug 09 20:32:52 <shayne>	quoll: agree
Aug 09 20:33:37 <guest>	Anyway we are meeting Saturday and that can only be blocked by continuous discussion.
Aug 09 20:33:45 <quoll>	basically wanted to ask where BIMC were up to in terms of mediation, meetings, etc; the discussion seems to have covered this
Aug 09 20:33:58 <guest>	Meeting to meeting. Jeez, we have a structure you know
Aug 09 20:34:12 <and_>	i propose that a feature about saturday meeting be posted in brisbane
Aug 09 20:34:21 <guest>	OK move on I've foreshadowed
Aug 09 20:34:22 <gdm>	i agree with and_
Aug 09 20:34:33 <gdm>	guest/kimci: can u send a feature in??
Aug 09 20:34:48 <gdm>	details of the meeting: when and where etc
Aug 09 20:34:55 -->	allan_x has joined #oceania
Aug 09 20:34:56 <doll>	and: good idea, let all bim readers/community know
Aug 09 20:35:01 <shayne>	also kimci: If you ever see that den dekker guy. punch him. he sounds like a fucker.
Aug 09 20:35:10 <gdm>	it needs to be a complete open meeting
Aug 09 20:35:11 *	shayne kidding.
Aug 09 20:35:33 <gdm>	check http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Local/OceaniaConfFinalProposal for the requirements of the meeting minutes
Aug 09 20:35:35 <allan_x>	hey kids
Aug 09 20:35:40 <guest>	I'd need an IRC meeting with the current moderators if the feature was edited
Aug 09 20:35:41 <gdm>	hey allan_x
Aug 09 20:35:46 <gdm>	check the topic ;-)
Aug 09 20:35:58 <and_>	can;t you ddo it via email kimci?
Aug 09 20:36:07 <and_>	as most features are done
Aug 09 20:36:15 <guest>	how do I check the topic
Aug 09 20:36:23 <gdm>	none of the features have been edited
Aug 09 20:36:26 <gdm>	type /topic
Aug 09 20:36:27 <allan_x>	click on topic
Aug 09 20:36:44 <guest>	Only if needed
Aug 09 20:36:45 <gdm>	all are posted 'as are' [unless rejected]
Aug 09 20:37:05 <and_>	ammendment to proposal: that it be posted on wednesday morning 9am at the lastest
Aug 09 20:37:13 <gdm>	it would be done via email as all the others  have been
Aug 09 20:37:29 <gdm>	if it is proposed tonight, there is a 24hour embargo, so itwould be, and_
Aug 09 20:37:35 <gdm>	guest/kimci: comments?
Aug 09 20:37:50 <shayne>	sure. Guest: As long as its not inflamatory shite that would be blocked by an otherwise healthy collective, then it probably wouldnt need changing.
Aug 09 20:37:57 <guest>	Takver and I have an oustanding disagreement over compulsary pagan ritual in Bread and Roses as the reason for membership nonacceptance. I don't want him to be a site moderator of it.
Aug 09 20:38:37 <gdm>	takver is working openly and no one else has a problem with how he operates (so far)
Aug 09 20:38:48 <gdm>	if there are problems, i'm sure they would be dealt wiuth
Aug 09 20:38:48 <guest>	takver is away
Aug 09 20:39:04 <gdm>	personally,  i work with takver on www-features and i think he is an excellent site admin
Aug 09 20:39:12 <and_>	can you post the meeting straight away to the active calendar kimci?
Aug 09 20:39:12 <guest>	and not taking my side queries during this meeting
Aug 09 20:39:24 <gdm>	full of energy and writes some excellent features
Aug 09 20:39:36 <and_>	how has this saturday meeting been advertised guest?
Aug 09 20:39:39 <shayne>	Kim: Perhaps if you ask Takver politely, he might back away. He's a nice enough guy imho and might agree.
Aug 09 20:39:48 <guest>	Yeah, I like him. I just don't trust him to approve a feature i write
Aug 09 20:40:03 <gdm>	he has to work within the concensus of the group
Aug 09 20:40:08 <doll>	isnt the feature going to be very basic..like an announcement of the nmeeting?
Aug 09 20:40:09 <guest>	or hide off the newswire etc, etc.
Aug 09 20:40:10 <gdm>	like everyone ;-)
Aug 09 20:40:34 <and_>	yeah, how could an announcement of a meeting be controversial?
Aug 09 20:40:38 <guest>	I'm citing Conflict of interests from past dispute
Aug 09 20:40:42 <gdm>	guest/kimci: will u write a feature please?? and can u answer the question instead of sidetracking....
Aug 09 20:40:48 <doll>	...without getting into the old history an dmurk..
Aug 09 20:40:50 <and_>	the meeting isnot even on the brisbane indy calendar
Aug 09 20:40:51 <quoll>	 I don't thinkl Takver is the only one to approve features ;->
Aug 09 20:40:57 <gdm>	yes or no
Aug 09 20:41:09 <gdm>	and, everyone else, please give guest/kimci space to respond
Aug 09 20:41:10 <guest>	I'll write the feature
Aug 09 20:41:17 <gdm>	thank you
Aug 09 20:41:27 <and_>	and put it on the calendar straight away?
Aug 09 20:41:28 <gdm>	shall we move on?
Aug 09 20:41:38 <guest>	yes
Aug 09 20:41:41 <wowi>	no.
Aug 09 20:41:41 <and_>	cool
Aug 09 20:41:49 <gdm>	wowi: comments?
Aug 09 20:41:51 <and_>	no?
Aug 09 20:41:52 <wowi>	i'm interested as to whether it'll be on the calender
Aug 09 20:41:53 <guest>	hello takver
Aug 09 20:42:19 <and_>	anyone can publish to the calendar though
Aug 09 20:42:28 <wowi>	ok. so add it
Aug 09 20:42:33 <guest>	he's probably just recording this meeting
Aug 09 20:42:34 <gdm>	yes: when the feature is submitted, it should also go on the calendar. if kimci doesn't do this, one of the admins can publish it if/when the feature is posted
Aug 09 20:42:47 <wowi>	cool
Aug 09 20:42:50 <guest>	What calendar?
Aug 09 20:43:11 <gdm>	bris active calendar, i think
Aug 09 20:43:16 <gdm>	now, moving on to....
Aug 09 20:43:18 <allan_x>	[i thought there already had been a feature?]
Aug 09 20:43:23 <gdm>	Video Project
Aug 09 20:43:27 <gdm>	Video Project
Aug 09 20:43:28 <gdm>	Video Project
Aug 09 20:43:31 <guest>	OK, Jodie Green lives with me.
Aug 09 20:43:32 <and_>	the link in the to right of your site says "Find out what's happening in your local area and post your event happenings at Active Brisbane."
Aug 09 20:43:38 <gdm>	Video Project
Aug 09 20:43:39 <gdm>	Video Project
Aug 09 20:43:39 <gdm>	Video Project
Aug 09 20:43:44 <and_>	ok ok ok
Aug 09 20:43:48 <and_>	:)
Aug 09 20:43:48 <gdm>	end of brisbane discussion!
Aug 09 20:43:53 <wowi>	what about asia stuff?
Aug 09 20:43:55 <and_>	:)
Aug 09 20:43:55 <guest>	next?
Aug 09 20:44:01 <and_>	lol
Aug 09 20:44:07 <guest>	background?
Aug 09 20:44:16 *	and_ sees gdms hair standing on end ;)
Aug 09 20:44:25 <gdm>	coming back to asia-pacific next meeting when  ppl from phillipines around and we have had more discussion on lists etc
Aug 09 20:44:30 <allan_x>	[hey sorry but can someone gimme a brief?]
Aug 09 20:44:31 <wowi>	go onto vid project.. we've lost goat
Aug 09 20:44:34 <and_>	agreed
Aug 09 20:44:38 <wowi>	good
Aug 09 20:44:43 <gdm>	and_ can u start?
Aug 09 20:44:46 <guest>	goat?
Aug 09 20:44:47 <and_>	yep
Aug 09 20:44:53 <wowi>	can i give a quick report back on it?
Aug 09 20:45:02 <guest>	vid project?
Aug 09 20:45:05 <and_>	anna and i will hopefully meet with dave this week or early next week
Aug 09 20:45:18 <and_>	to discuss use of server
Aug 09 20:45:20 <wowi>	no. asia stuff.. after this.
Aug 09 20:45:28 <guest>	kewl
Aug 09 20:45:29 <and_>	and a bunch of the tech stuff
Aug 09 20:45:39 <guest>	vid project?
Aug 09 20:45:53 <and_>	andy has played with the code
Aug 09 20:46:00 <and_>	and got it happenignon cat
Aug 09 20:46:00 <doll>	guest: background to video is on oceania wiki
Aug 09 20:46:11 <guest>	looking
Aug 09 20:46:28 <and_>	http://ivdn.cat.org.au//en/
Aug 09 20:46:35 <and_>	that's the test site
Aug 09 20:46:59 <and_>	basically needs toget set up on nomasters
Aug 09 20:47:04 <and_>	mirroring to archive.org
Aug 09 20:47:11 <and_>	p2p set up, rss etc
Aug 09 20:47:19 <and_>	and a funkyly designed page
Aug 09 20:47:30 <and_>	that's what i know at least, might be more
Aug 09 20:47:31 <doll>	and: i dont ghet that test site..is it showing it cxan pull videos off any # of sites..as RSS stream ?
Aug 09 20:47:51 <and_>	i don't get it that well either
Aug 09 20:47:52 <gdm>	yeah, i didn't understand it either
Aug 09 20:47:58 <and_>	i think we need to talk to andy
Aug 09 20:48:00 *	doll :b
Aug 09 20:48:11 <and_>	i'm not sure where that is pulling videos from
Aug 09 20:48:28 <doll>	its shows it can grab them i guess
Aug 09 20:48:28 <and_>	from what i understand though the basic idea is to upload to nomasters
Aug 09 20:48:45 <and_>	and then mirror to archive and then display on our own site
Aug 09 20:48:56 <doll>	ppl upload their vids to nomasters via FTP...then test site pulls them down..?
Aug 09 20:49:16 <and_>	i think so, but it mirrors to archive.org first
Aug 09 20:49:21 <doll>	ok
Aug 09 20:49:25 <and_>	so they take most of the bandwidth
Aug 09 20:49:29 <and_>	this is not set up yet
Aug 09 20:49:31 <doll>	good
Aug 09 20:49:48 <and_>	i think perhaps after we speak with dave an irc meet woould be good jst about video project
Aug 09 20:50:06 <doll>	ive checked out archive and they seem to have a deal withy creativecommons and require ppl to specify creaytive commons licenses to their videos
Aug 09 20:50:19 <guest>	anyone seen the http://www.killyourtv.us/ Adam is working on the oceania newsreel and has lots of local content. Be good to get some cross linking going.
Aug 09 20:50:22 <and_>	yeah, that's cool
Aug 09 20:50:34 <and_>	adam is not workingon oceania newsreel
Aug 09 20:50:38 <and_>	he has dropped it
Aug 09 20:50:44 <doll>	but just this week debian crew have come out saying these CC licenses are a bit shite..anyway..ill post the deets to the video list..
Aug 09 20:50:45 <and_>	people spoke to him last week
Aug 09 20:51:01 <guest>	They might be interested in indymedia having all their content or share mirroring
Aug 09 20:51:01 <and_>	be cool if you sent that
Aug 09 20:51:11 <and_>	def. guest
Aug 09 20:51:12 <pabs>	guest: can u ask him why he didn't reply to emails from me asking for dealines, formats etc?
Aug 09 20:51:18 <pabs>	deadlines
Aug 09 20:51:20 <and_>	adam is on the list i think
Aug 09 20:51:32 <and_>	melbourne is going to dothe next newsreal i'm pretty sure
Aug 09 20:51:46 <and_>	need to check with anna, she is out of contact at the moment in newcastle
Aug 09 20:52:06 <guest>	who has newsreel now? We are going to have a lot of content to choose from because of KYTVs new ch31 show
Aug 09 20:52:32 <and_>	melbourne should be doing it but that is to be confirmed guest
Aug 09 20:52:34 <guest>	I'll suggest they appoint a liason.
Aug 09 20:52:37 <and_>	cool
Aug 09 20:52:57 <and_>	doll: you know any good designers who might like to design a video page?
Aug 09 20:53:28 <doll>	and: i will ask around..yes..cd be...
Aug 09 20:53:30 <guest>	nomasters to archive. I like it
Aug 09 20:53:43 <and_>	cool
Aug 09 20:53:48 <pabs>	it does bittorrent and some other p2p things too
Aug 09 20:54:06 <and_>	maybe a meeting in 2 weeks to discuss specifically
Aug 09 20:54:19 <and_>	we really need anna, andy and warwick in this conversation
Aug 09 20:54:26 <gdm>	suggest that that is proposed via the oceania-video list
Aug 09 20:54:27 <doll>	pabs: the test site does bittorrents
Aug 09 20:54:28 <guest>	P2P bittorrent is best I reckon
Aug 09 20:54:36 <gdm>	meeting, i mean
Aug 09 20:54:52 <and_>	the todo list is here
Aug 09 20:54:53 <and_>	http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Local/ImcOceaniaOnlineVideo
Aug 09 20:55:03 <and_>	might be adding the CC stuff doll
Aug 09 20:55:34 <and_>	sorry, might be worth you adding the CC stuff doll
Aug 09 20:55:37 <guest>	Adam may be interested in desighning a front page
Aug 09 20:56:27 <and_>	other things we could work on while we wait on tech stuff is some kind of ed policy
Aug 09 20:56:37 <guest>	he only has to alter his template. I could get the code and do that. P2P is best server side for our needs
Aug 09 20:56:58 <doll>	and: yup./.of course i cant find it (CC vs debian) now in my inbox debacle but i
Aug 09 20:57:01 <and_>	what template?
Aug 09 20:57:01 <doll>	will
Aug 09 20:58:07 <guest>	freenet anyone? Be great to have a freenet portal off the vid site. active2 was talking about doing that. Anyone know who exactly?
Aug 09 20:58:21 <--	quoll has quit (Quit: Chatzilla 0.9.64b [Mozilla rv:1.7/20040614])
Aug 09 20:58:40 <guest>	Great for plausable deniability and fine grained permission access
Aug 09 20:58:54 <and_>	be really good to be able to get it together for the newcastle festival also
Aug 09 20:58:58 <pabs>	guest: that really isn't apropriate for large video files
Aug 09 20:59:07 <guest>	http://www.killyourtv.us/ template
Aug 09 20:59:10 -->	quoll has joined #oceania
Aug 09 20:59:32 <gdm>	is everyone going to newcastle??
Aug 09 20:59:34 <and_>	so that we can actually have something working to show people and get them excited about
Aug 09 20:59:37 <gdm>	i don't think i can make it
Aug 09 20:59:41 *	pabs wishes
Aug 09 20:59:41 *	and_ is i think
Aug 09 20:59:52 <and_>	it's 1.5 hours gdm
Aug 09 21:00:02 <gdm>	yeah, i'm working nights
Aug 09 21:00:07 <and_>	bummer
Aug 09 21:00:24 *	wowi is scabbing bux 
Aug 09 21:00:52 <guest>	can run a freenet hub with a server window off freenet. It refreshes off hubs caches
Aug 09 21:01:23 *	and_ is not a fan of kill yr tv design, frames ughg!
Aug 09 21:01:28 <allan_x>	newcastle?
Aug 09 21:01:32 <pabs>	tina
Aug 09 21:01:47 <doll>	newcastle.electrofringe
Aug 09 21:01:54 <allan_x>	:)
Aug 09 21:02:01 <quoll>	when?
Aug 09 21:02:23 <pabs>	october?
Aug 09 21:02:37 <allan_x>	1st wkend in oct
Aug 09 21:02:39 <and_>	sept 30 to oct 4
Aug 09 21:02:58 <gdm>	oh: sept 30, not august 30??
Aug 09 21:02:59 <doll>	http://www.electrofringe.org/
Aug 09 21:03:06 <gdm>	maybe i'm not working nights!!
Aug 09 21:03:07 <guest>	Can set the cache on freenet to automatically update at reasonable intervals and still be unable to pinpoint a  file. 
Aug 09 21:03:10 <and_>	be really good to have something up by then
Aug 09 21:03:31 <and_>	and launch as newie fest, a bit of a deadline for us
Aug 09 21:03:53 <and_>	i will call anna and andy tomorrow personally
Aug 09 21:03:59 <and_>	see where it's all at
Aug 09 21:04:00 <guest>	Can use that template... 
Aug 09 21:04:42 <guest>	frames are great for RSS feeds
Aug 09 21:04:50 <and_>	frames are ugly!
Aug 09 21:05:03 <guest>	custom sub windows with common tool bars
Aug 09 21:05:19 <quoll>	frames are *very bad* in terms of usability
Aug 09 21:05:24 <allan_x>	[er, btw - is urban artdoc vid getting discussed here tonight?]
Aug 09 21:05:26 <doll>	for sure newie wd be good for letten ppl know about distributing their vidz onloine,,,wd be gd to run a workshop
Aug 09 21:05:43 <wowi>	alan_x: no weds nite 6pm
Aug 09 21:05:55 <and_>	yeah doll: definetly
Aug 09 21:05:55 <allan_x>	k
Aug 09 21:06:05 *	doll have been filmen street art this week fer urbartdoc
Aug 09 21:06:06 <gdm>	ok, any more video stuff?
Aug 09 21:06:17 <and_>	maybe we can leave it for the moment and do an update soon
Aug 09 21:06:21 <guest>	Ok. No frames. Design the site to be easily frameable [RSS?]
Aug 09 21:06:43 <wowi>	doll: cool!
Aug 09 21:07:46 <gdm>	any more video stuff?
Aug 09 21:07:56 <and_>	i don't think so
Aug 09 21:07:59 <pabs>	DEATH TO REALMEDIA
Aug 09 21:08:02 <guest>	Then we can have a whats new on IMC video column on users indymedia home pages
Aug 09 21:08:14 <gdm>	lol@pabs
Aug 09 21:08:23 <guest>	Brisbane is going for LDAP
Aug 09 21:08:35 <guest>	logon
Aug 09 21:09:18 <gdm>	shall we move onto any other business???
Aug 09 21:09:22 <wowi>	yes
Aug 09 21:09:24 <guest>	next?
Aug 09 21:09:25 <and_>	is that the agenda then?
Aug 09 21:09:33 <gdm>	yes, and_
Aug 09 21:09:36 <shayne>	guest: you should look into drupal: Its got alot of the ideas you guys want for a codebase,
Aug 09 21:09:56 <gdm>	3 things so far....
Aug 09 21:09:57 <shayne>	has an ldap mod for auth, and if you get it going I get to steal your schema :)
Aug 09 21:10:11 <and_>	wowi had finance stuff
Aug 09 21:10:13 <pabs>	shayne: i was gonna suggest dada cause of the accountability of the editing stuff
Aug 09 21:10:25 <gdm>	a-p quick report from wowi, reply-to headers ;-), and urbart vid update, now finance also
Aug 09 21:10:34 <gdm>	anything else to add??
Aug 09 21:10:39 <doll>	wowi: :-) have sum nice stuff,,,went on a treasure hunt set up by anarchist cat woman
Aug 09 21:10:46 <shayne>	yeah. true. but its not as extensible, and the brissy guys have some interesting ideas on modding thats worth trying out.
Aug 09 21:11:25 <pabs>	...back on topic - wowi ?
Aug 09 21:11:41 <gdm>	shayne: do u guys need more time discussing or are u happy to continue elsewhere?
Aug 09 21:11:49 <gdm>	and pabs ;-)
Aug 09 21:11:51 <shayne>	I'll chat with kim offchannel
Aug 09 21:12:07 <pabs>	#brisbanecodebase?
Aug 09 21:12:13 <gdm>	ok
Aug 09 21:12:26 <gdm>	wowi: report back on a-p stuff?
Aug 09 21:13:35 <wowi>	oops
Aug 09 21:13:36 <wowi>	yeh
Aug 09 21:13:54 <wowi>	it's asia/mutual aid stuff
Aug 09 21:14:02 <gdm>	ok, go
Aug 09 21:14:15 <wowi>	i just got off the fone from bowo, from jakarta imc
Aug 09 21:14:17 <guest>	will continue on brisbanecoe
Aug 09 21:14:38 <guest>	go
Aug 09 21:14:48 <doll>	whats happening in indo...? many peeps involved?
Aug 09 21:14:58 <wowi>	he's going to use the jakarta-imc list again..
Aug 09 21:15:25 <wowi>	um.. a few (i didn't get an answer) bad reception
Aug 09 21:15:29 <wowi>	i'll email him
Aug 09 21:15:34 <wowi>	there's the new collective
Aug 09 21:15:44 <wowi>	who are trying to get the keys to the old collectives site..
Aug 09 21:16:04 <wowi>	old collective has forgotten passwords.. so that needs fixing
Aug 09 21:16:20 <wowi>	also: they want to change their interface..
Aug 09 21:16:22 <wowi>	?
Aug 09 21:16:44 <wowi>	so er tech types.. email bowo or join imc-jakarta list
Aug 09 21:16:44 <and_>	on what server is jakarta now?
Aug 09 21:16:56 <doll>	it generally seems a good sitch there at the moment -- enuff ppl and skills etc? access to tech?
Aug 09 21:16:57 <wowi>	he couldn't tell me
Aug 09 21:17:00 <and_>	finn was doing tech with jakarta
Aug 09 21:17:19 <wowi>	i told him to talk tech with peeps on oceania list
Aug 09 21:17:24 <and_>	cool
Aug 09 21:17:33 <wowi>	and brought up the conf mutual aid funds stuff
Aug 09 21:17:43 <wowi>	he's going to talk to the collective about that
Aug 09 21:17:57 <guest>	somebody confirm password changes to their main or ed list pls
Aug 09 21:18:38 <wowi>	so.. i'll email him more stuff and check on archives where it's hosted.. i also asked him to sus with old collective..
Aug 09 21:18:42 <wowi>	he was vague tho
Aug 09 21:18:49 <wowi>	on finance stuff..
Aug 09 21:19:09 <wowi>	terry from manila sent me their old finance proposal a wk ago
Aug 09 21:19:10 <and_>	yeah, i think jakarta needs quite a bit of help and telephoning too, rther than just email
Aug 09 21:19:17 <wowi>	sure
Aug 09 21:19:19 <and_>	which is already being done obviously
Aug 09 21:19:26 <wowi>	he check 2x a wk tho
Aug 09 21:19:41 <and_>	ok, doesn't respond much though
Aug 09 21:19:42 <wowi>	that's ok.. but i'll do a follow up call next wk maybe
Aug 09 21:19:48 <doll>	wowi: is there sum overlap wiv old n nu collectives?
Aug 09 21:19:49 <and_>	did he get email i had sent did he say?
Aug 09 21:19:53 <wowi>	he agreed to use the list again
Aug 09 21:19:57 <wowi>	no
Aug 09 21:20:00 <and_>	sum overlap?
Aug 09 21:20:08 <and_>	oh, no
Aug 09 21:20:16 <wowi>	he only talks to one person from the old collective
Aug 09 21:20:22 <and_>	original jakarta collecive died ages ago
Aug 09 21:20:31 <doll>	the sites pretty bad
Aug 09 21:20:31 <wowi>	which is part of the prob with using the site i think
Aug 09 21:20:38 <and_>	publishing should be stopped
Aug 09 21:20:52 <wowi>	..shall we suggest to start a new one altogether?
Aug 09 21:20:58 <and_>	there is no collective at all to speak of and the new one has no access
Aug 09 21:20:59 <wowi>	i think he likes the url tho
Aug 09 21:21:07 <and_>	finn has started building a new site
Aug 09 21:21:23 <and_>	they can have the url, they just have to go through new-imc
Aug 09 21:21:29 <wowi>	good.. when is finn contactable agen?
Aug 09 21:21:40 <wowi>	is he intouch with bowo?
Aug 09 21:22:08 <guest>	bowo's address?
Aug 09 21:22:13 <and_>	he was, dont know now
Aug 09 21:22:20 <and_>	i think we have to wait to talk to finn
Aug 09 21:22:36 <and_>	but people can start by taking them through newimc process
Aug 09 21:23:30 <wowi>	kim: bowo perthimc asn au.. he's contactable on oceania and jakarta-imc lists too.. he's said he'll use them
Aug 09 21:23:37 <and_>	jakarta dev site
Aug 09 21:23:38 <and_>	http://jakartadev.cat.org.au
Aug 09 21:23:38 <pabs>	just bow marie
Aug 09 21:24:15 <wowi>	ok
Aug 09 21:24:20 <guest>	you'l need some sort of quorum to remain on the cities.inc
Aug 09 21:25:11 <gdm>	shall we move on?
Aug 09 21:25:16 <gdm>	[my connection is v slow atm]
Aug 09 21:25:19 <wowi>	kim: are you offering him tech help?
Aug 09 21:25:19 <--	takver has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
Aug 09 21:25:19 <wowi>	yep.. manila stuff
Aug 09 21:25:25 <wowi>	briefly cos they're not here
Aug 09 21:25:29 <and_>	they are totally using the feature section
Aug 09 21:25:29 <and_>	2 features in last 5 days
Aug 09 21:25:29 <--	doll has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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Aug 09 21:25:39 <wowi>	yay!
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Aug 09 21:26:12 <guest>	I'l offering a current comparison chart on CMS software for indymedia
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Aug 09 21:26:40 <and_>	they are using dada kimci
Aug 09 21:26:53 <and_>	most of the work has already been done
Aug 09 21:27:00 <and_>	on tech stuff
Aug 09 21:27:34 <guest>	OK, there was a mention of new software. Was it just retemplating ?
Aug 09 21:27:58 <and_>	i think we should leave this till finn is around
Aug 09 21:28:04 <and_>	jakarya tech stuff
Aug 09 21:28:09 <wowi>	yeh
Aug 09 21:28:14 <guest>	I'll talk to Finn
Aug 09 21:28:23 <guest>	too
Aug 09 21:28:25 <wowi>	and till bow tells us what he needs on oceania
Aug 09 21:28:41 <gdm>	ok, move on?
Aug 09 21:28:54 <wowi>	which is my suggested course to him.. while we search out who's hosting the old site and get the passwords.
Aug 09 21:28:57 <guest>	thats why a features checklist is important in participatory design
Aug 09 21:28:57 <wowi>	yup
Aug 09 21:29:02 <gdm>	ok
Aug 09 21:29:04 <wowi>	yep.. manila stuff
Aug 09 21:29:09 <wowi>	briefly cos they're not here
Aug 09 21:29:14 <gdm>	go on then, wowi
Aug 09 21:29:18 <wowi>	just to mention..
Aug 09 21:29:37 <wowi>	terry fwded me their old finance proposal wk ago
Aug 09 21:29:50 <gdm>	yeah, is it coming to hte list?
Aug 09 21:29:55 <wowi>	i responded and cc'd to their list.. (if people wanna read)
Aug 09 21:29:56 <wowi>	um..
Aug 09 21:30:00 <wowi>	we're working on it
Aug 09 21:30:03 <gdm>	imc-oceania list
Aug 09 21:30:06 <gdm>	ok
Aug 09 21:30:12 <wowi>	i've suggested ways for her to move fwd
Aug 09 21:30:20 <wowi>	but yes.. she will propose to the list
Aug 09 21:30:29 <wowi>	the big issuse is a space.. 
Aug 09 21:30:49 <wowi>	but that aside they're really into getting murdoch guil comps
Aug 09 21:31:02 <gdm>	kool :-)
Aug 09 21:31:09 <gdm>	that's a great solidarity project
Aug 09 21:31:21 <wowi>	i'll keep talking with terry
Aug 09 21:31:32 <wowi>	and hopefully she'll let you all know herself.
Aug 09 21:31:33 <guest>	got to fix a band recording computer 5-10min
Aug 09 21:31:46 -->	Comrade_J has joined #oceania
Aug 09 21:31:50 <wowi>	it's imp that we do the asia network meeting asap tho
Aug 09 21:31:50 <gdm>	ok, bye. thanks for xoming
Aug 09 21:32:05 <and_>	hey comrade_J
Aug 09 21:32:10 <pabs>	lexi in #tech ppl
Aug 09 21:32:12 <gdm>	we need to make a date for next irc meet, too
Aug 09 21:32:18 <wowi>	defr
Aug 09 21:32:21 <Comrade_J>	hi
Aug 09 21:32:24 <doll>	mebbe we can invite the burma peeps to that mtg...thers bin sum action on imc-process
Aug 09 21:32:37 <gdm>	yes, good idea
Aug 09 21:32:39 <wowi>	we need a time that is suitable to manila and qc crew..
Aug 09 21:32:51 <wowi>	we all need to talk.
Aug 09 21:32:55 <gdm>	i asked theGoatasaguest and he said 6pm
Aug 09 21:33:08 <wowi>	shall we wask the lists?
Aug 09 21:33:08 <doll>	http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/advmeeting.html
Aug 09 21:33:11 <gdm>	i guess manila time
Aug 09 21:33:21 <wowi>	cos this may require a meeting on it's own.
Aug 09 21:33:34 <wowi>	with japan imc crew too
Aug 09 21:33:36 <and_>	yeah i think next time personal emails need to be made to make sure people will come
Aug 09 21:33:59 <gdm>	wowi, can u try and arrange an a-p meeting, then?
Aug 09 21:34:00 <wowi>	i will invite manila and qc
Aug 09 21:34:02 <doll>	is terry ok wiv IRC also//;/
Aug 09 21:34:08 <wowi>	and do some personal ones to crew 
Aug 09 21:34:10 <gdm>	say, tentatively, in  about 2 weeks??
Aug 09 21:34:11 <guest>	away for 10
Aug 09 21:34:17 <wowi>	esp jong
Aug 09 21:34:18 <gdm>	[that's a suggestion, btw]
Aug 09 21:34:28 <wowi>	hrm.. maybe one..
Aug 09 21:34:35 <gdm>	ok, one week
Aug 09 21:34:45 <and_>	no, 2 def i think
Aug 09 21:34:50 <wowi>	there is mounting tension.. 
Aug 09 21:34:52 <and_>	it will take a while to get responses
Aug 09 21:34:57 <wowi>	ok.
Aug 09 21:35:03 <and_>	i was almost gunna say 3
Aug 09 21:35:13 <wowi>	no more than 2
Aug 09 21:35:17 <gdm>	no: i think 2 weeks is good
Aug 09 21:35:31 <gdm>	enough to find out good times and still give ample warning
Aug 09 21:35:36 <wowi>	good..
Aug 09 21:35:53 <gdm>	any more on asia/mutual aid stuff?
Aug 09 21:35:53 <wowi>	and perhaps we should invite crew to set the agenda
Aug 09 21:35:58 <wowi>	so it gives time for that.
Aug 09 21:35:59 <gdm>	yes
Aug 09 21:36:00 <--	and_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
Aug 09 21:36:06 <gdm>	use a wiki page ;-)
Aug 09 21:36:14 <wowi>	..no we'll see how it happens
Aug 09 21:36:15 <wowi>	um.
Aug 09 21:36:24 <wowi>	i'm not sure wuth burma
Aug 09 21:36:38 <wowi>	but i think kim et al has it handled
Aug 09 21:36:48 <gdm>	well, i trust u
Aug 09 21:37:01 <gdm>	u can sort it well and i will be happy with your arrangements :-)
Aug 09 21:37:17 *	wowi looks around
Aug 09 21:37:23 <wowi>	who me?
Aug 09 21:37:29 <gdm>	yes
Aug 09 21:37:33 <wowi>	:)
Aug 09 21:37:35 <wowi>	cheers
Aug 09 21:37:50 <gdm>	move on?
Aug 09 21:38:11 <wowi>	yup!
Aug 09 21:38:21 <gdm>	i just wanna ask pabs as list admin to change the replyto headers as i suggested in http://lists.cat.org.au/pipermail/imc-oceania//2004-August/001673.html
Aug 09 21:38:24 <gdm>	on saturday
Aug 09 21:38:25 <--	RegularFibre has quit ()
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Aug 09 21:38:41 <gdm>	if there's no objections (there were none to the list) it doesn't really need to be discussed
Aug 09 21:38:43 <wowi>	i'm cool with that.. i bodged and email the other day.. 
Aug 09 21:39:17 <gdm>	then, we could discuss finance?
Aug 09 21:39:24 <doll>	i've bin confused about the + and -, but i'm cool with whatever is decided
Aug 09 21:39:49 <wowi>	finance..
Aug 09 21:39:55 <wowi>	process?
Aug 09 21:40:32 <gdm>	process for what? 
Aug 09 21:40:56 <wowi>	for finance
Aug 09 21:41:03 <wowi>	:P
Aug 09 21:41:16 <gdm>	and_ got stuff to say about finance?
Aug 09 21:41:20 <doll>	need to decide on decision maken process..if its not clear already
Aug 09 21:41:40 <and_>	umm, don't think so
Aug 09 21:41:44 <and_>	round $1400
Aug 09 21:41:50 <wowi>	so.. finance list?
Aug 09 21:41:53 <and_>	i sent all the stuff to the list
Aug 09 21:42:00 <wowi>	how should we deal with proposals..
Aug 09 21:42:00 <gdm>	kool, thx
Aug 09 21:42:15 <doll>	a finace list to make recommendations to the general luist?
Aug 09 21:42:15 <gdm>	wowi: i say yes to a list. i liked your proposals
Aug 09 21:42:21 <wowi>	there have been a few informal ones already
Aug 09 21:42:22 <gdm>	yes to doll
Aug 09 21:42:26 <wowi>	cool
Aug 09 21:42:44 <wowi>	i'll put it to the list.. if there's no dissent i'll ask andy to make one
Aug 09 21:42:46 *	and_ won't block if there are people comitted to doing it
Aug 09 21:42:50 <wowi>	i am
Aug 09 21:42:54 <gdm>	me too
Aug 09 21:42:57 <doll>	i wd be interetsed
Aug 09 21:43:06 <gdm>	aotearoa ppl? zl2tod??
Aug 09 21:43:07 <wowi>	ok.. that's a start..
Aug 09 21:43:20 <gdm>	Comrade_J
Aug 09 21:43:21 *	and_ might even join the list :)
Aug 09 21:43:25 <wowi>	hey and_ seeing as you're the bean counting type..?
Aug 09 21:43:27 <wowi>	hehe
Aug 09 21:43:31 <and_>	haha
Aug 09 21:43:33 <allan_x>	me too maybe
Aug 09 21:43:36 <and_>	i am over bean counting
Aug 09 21:43:39 *	doll curently inspired by eastern european friends who were funed by SOROS..the more u sopent, the more u received, and the more prohjjects happened
Aug 09 21:43:39 <gdm>	yeah, control freak ;-)
Aug 09 21:43:50 <wowi>	ok and i'm sure there'll be other crew from asia etc into it
Aug 09 21:43:54 <gdm>	SOROS as in george soros??
Aug 09 21:43:55 *	and_ give up
Aug 09 21:44:02 <and_>	:)
Aug 09 21:44:04 <wowi>	just to sept he discussion and discuss a process.. 
Aug 09 21:44:14 <doll>	gdm: yup
Aug 09 21:44:26 <wowi>	doll: lets email him :))
Aug 09 21:44:28 <gdm>	whoa: dodgy?!
Aug 09 21:44:35 <gdm>	no way
Aug 09 21:44:39 <zl2tod>	NZ has been the beneficiary of a benefit screening of fahrenheit 911 which has generated about $200 ... other than that there's been a saga about organising the domain renewal ... more than that I don;t know anything
Aug 09 21:44:41 <gdm>	can't use dirty money
Aug 09 21:44:48 <doll>	gdm: complex ,,and dodhy..but ...thass anuvva discussiioon
Aug 09 21:44:49 <and_>	this is too big a discussion for now
Aug 09 21:44:54 <and_>	lets stop
Aug 09 21:45:02 *	gdm agrees
Aug 09 21:45:05 <wowi>	ok.. doit on finance list :)
Aug 09 21:45:10 <wowi>	i'll email andy and the list
Aug 09 21:45:12 <guest>	I'm back
Aug 09 21:45:18 *	and_ unsubs from finance list already :)
Aug 09 21:45:20 <gdm>	zl2tod: talking oceania finance - suggesting having a imc-oceania-finance list
Aug 09 21:45:24 <gdm>	what do u think?
Aug 09 21:45:39 <pabs>	make it oceania-finance
Aug 09 21:45:52 <zl2tod>	i can't speak for nz on this ... I've heard no locval talk on it
Aug 09 21:46:10 <gdm>	no: it's just been coming up in the past week or so
Aug 09 21:46:19 <gdm>	if u can communicate it to nz, that'd be great
Aug 09 21:46:24 <wowi>	cool
Aug 09 21:46:25 <gdm>	pabs: yes
Aug 09 21:46:27 <zl2tod>	ok
Aug 09 21:46:31 <gdm>	thanks
Aug 09 21:46:36 <wowi>	i'll formerly propose to oceania list first..
Aug 09 21:46:46 <wowi>	incase there's dissent.
Aug 09 21:46:47 <zl2tod>	is there a url for background anywhere ?
Aug 09 21:46:48 -->	quoll_ has joined #oceania
Aug 09 21:47:14 <gdm>	yes, i'll just find it
Aug 09 21:47:36 <guest>	invite crew? is that a nick or a group
Aug 09 21:47:50 <gdm>	http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Local/ImcOceaniaFinance
Aug 09 21:47:58 <gdm>	started there - please add stuff people!!!
Aug 09 21:48:13 <wowi>	will do gdm.. 
Aug 09 21:48:15 <gdm>	guest - ??
Aug 09 21:48:26 <gdm>	ok, any more on finance??
Aug 09 21:48:41 <--	quoll has quit (Ping timeout: 600 seconds)
Aug 09 21:48:41 <and_>	not from me
Aug 09 21:48:51 <gdm>	allan_x: fire away on a new topic!
Aug 09 21:49:07 <wowi>	we'll discuss on list. manila and jakarta should respond soonish
Aug 09 21:49:07 <allan_x>	urban art doco
Aug 09 21:49:12 <wowi>	brisbane bux?
Aug 09 21:50:12 <wowi>	..wait for proposals..
Aug 09 21:50:33 <--	quoll_ has quit (Client Quit)
Aug 09 21:50:42 <zl2tod>	so the proposal is whether or not to start an oceania-finance list ? is there the traffic to support it ? can it be dealt with on existing lists ?
Aug 09 21:51:10 <wowi>	yes there is..
Aug 09 21:51:25 <wowi>	it can be but this is the beginning of a finance process.
Aug 09 21:51:38 -->	quoll has joined #oceania
Aug 09 21:51:44 <gdm>	suggestion was to have a list focussed on finance. there prob is the traffic. the list can discuss stuff in detail then make (final) proposals for agreement to the iomc-oceania list
Aug 09 21:52:03 <wowi>	it may be prudent to seperate discussion now.. before formal proposals come
Aug 09 21:52:05 <gdm>	just cuts some of the longer finance discussions from the main list
Aug 09 21:52:15 *	gdm agrees with wowi
Aug 09 21:52:17 <wowi>	yup that too
Aug 09 21:52:24 <zl2tod>	from what I've seen of the process in other places ... finance gets more or less hijacked by being hidden away on it's own list
Aug 09 21:52:41 <wowi>	anyone can join and its publicly archived
Aug 09 21:52:45 <wowi>	where's the hiding?
Aug 09 21:52:45 <doll>	bt it cd be an open and archied list, no?
Aug 09 21:52:51 <doll>	archived
Aug 09 21:52:55 <wowi>	yes def!!
Aug 09 21:53:06 <gdm>	and open!
Aug 09 21:53:24 <gdm>	i'm not aware of other finance lists being secretly archived
Aug 09 21:53:40 <doll>	all of the oceania lists r open
Aug 09 21:54:13 <wowi>	i just think finance is too imp to be buried in list traffic
Aug 09 21:54:33 <guest>	Wasn't soros famous for wall less offices for freeform organising? I never worked out if that was the same soros as the investor 
Aug 09 21:54:41 <wowi>	and can be potentially volatile.. (i hope never) it's good to keep it sep
Aug 09 21:54:45 <allan_x>	fully agree wowi\
Aug 09 21:54:55 <wowi>	sensative stuff $
Aug 09 21:55:15 *	doll agee .. put suggestion for finance list to oceania list
Aug 09 21:55:24 <doll>	agree also
Aug 09 21:55:29 <allan_x>	yeah - and keep open and inclusive
Aug 09 21:55:30 <gdm>	ok
Aug 09 21:55:35 <gdm>	yes
Aug 09 21:55:35 <wowi>	will do :)
Aug 09 21:55:40 <allan_x>	:)
Aug 09 21:55:51 <gdm>	imc-finance is open archives
Aug 09 21:55:54 <guest>	Any post structural decisions to all the oceania groups lists? Eg finance list
Aug 09 21:56:03 <gdm>	http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/listinfo/imc-finance
Aug 09 21:56:14 <and_>	you talking lyotard?
Aug 09 21:56:28 <wowi>	and finance would report to main list i imagine
Aug 09 21:56:34 <gdm>	yes
Aug 09 21:56:37 <guest>	BIMC is even considering leaving oceania. But we'll probably just leave CAT hosting [not the subdomain]
Aug 09 21:56:48 <doll>	finace wd havta report to main, and request discussion and ratification
Aug 09 21:57:20 <zl2tod>	open and archived doesn't mean that anyone actually sees it, and doesn't prevent faits accomplis ... there are very few finance related posts to imc oceania, and it's a low traffic list anyway - i don't think a seperate list is helpful at this time except to stifle discussion
Aug 09 21:57:27 <allan_x>	bimc leaving :(
Aug 09 21:57:28 <doll>	gdm: is that the greater indymedia finance list?
Aug 09 21:57:39 <guest>	posting structural developments to local lists is important. Lots of people aren't on the oceania list
Aug 09 21:57:40 <wowi>	doll: cool.. i'll add that to my proposal
Aug 09 21:57:48 <gdm>	doll: yes
Aug 09 21:58:28 <doll>	i suggest we put the proposal for a sep finance list on oceasnia, and letr ppl discuss it in that forum
Aug 09 21:58:31 <gdm>	well, zl2tod, i think that is an important pov and we should definitely discuss it
Aug 09 21:58:39 <wowi>	done
Aug 09 21:58:41 <guest>	OK
Aug 09 21:58:49 <allan_x>	[fin list consensus-based]
Aug 09 21:58:52 <gdm>	i think that a proposal should be sent to the list, with discussion period of a week or so
Aug 09 21:58:53 <shayne>	may I suggest for accountability sake that any decision made by a 
Aug 09 21:59:08 <doll>	consensus yes
Aug 09 21:59:09 <shayne>	money list spend 3 days on main list
Aug 09 21:59:16 <gdm>	all the details can be clarified and then either agreed or not to have a new list
Aug 09 21:59:20 *	shayne might of not been paying full attention
Aug 09 21:59:29 <allan_x>	AT LEAST 3days id have thought
Aug 09 21:59:30 <wowi>	a wk even
Aug 09 21:59:34 <guest>	somebody needs to compile oceania standing agreements for all local lists. I could do that but I might need some links for all the meeting minutes
Aug 09 21:59:36 <gdm>	a week
Aug 09 21:59:37 <shayne>	sure
Aug 09 21:59:54 <allan_x>	further discuss on oceania list?
Aug 09 22:00:01 <gdm>	yes
Aug 09 22:00:11 <shayne>	Ie, let money heads thrash it thru.
Aug 09 22:00:22 <gdm>	move on??
Aug 09 22:00:22 <shayne>	then when proposed, punk it via main for aproval
Aug 09 22:00:29 <wowi>	gdm: yep
Aug 09 22:00:37 <wowi>	shayne: exact;y
Aug 09 22:00:47 <guest>	via main?
Aug 09 22:00:59 <guest>	???
Aug 09 22:01:00 <shayne>	imc-oceania
Aug 09 22:01:22 <guest>	on the condition that oceania sends a copy of any decisions to all the local lists
Aug 09 22:01:28 <wowi>	i'll put it to list.. zl2tod: are you happy to voice reservations on list in response to the proppsal?
Aug 09 22:01:39 <shayne>	well thats not really how oceania works guest.
Aug 09 22:01:45 <wowi>	??
Aug 09 22:01:48 <and_>	what?
Aug 09 22:01:52 <wowi>	just join oceania
Aug 09 22:01:53 <shayne>	oceania seems pretty much a recallable delegate scenario
Aug 09 22:02:06 <shayne>	with fuzzy assed rules about how many delegates
Aug 09 22:02:08 <and_>	the idea of having an oceania list is so that we don't have to email to all local lists!
Aug 09 22:02:09 <wowi>	or imc crew report back.. or read archives
Aug 09 22:02:10 <gdm>	yes: but we're gettign off topic now
Aug 09 22:02:10 <shayne>	ie its not really thought thru
Aug 09 22:02:20 <gdm>	zl2tod: u will voice concerns on list?? yes or no?
Aug 09 22:02:20 <doll>	guest: i i think its indivisduals repsaonsibility to sub to oceania main if they wanna follow and participate in network wide  discussions..
Aug 09 22:02:31 <wowi>	gdm: true
Aug 09 22:02:33 <gdm>	please allow zl2tod to reply
Aug 09 22:02:38 *	wowi agrees with doll
Aug 09 22:02:40 <pabs>	i hope this ain't gonna be another 6hr meeting
Aug 09 22:02:54 <gdm>	zl2tod
Aug 09 22:02:58 <gdm>	?
Aug 09 22:03:03 *	wowi needs to go soon.. i'm not even home yet
Aug 09 22:03:12 <allan_x>	[just briefly: urban art doco stuff...]
Aug 09 22:03:15 <gdm>	yeah, we can be quick
Aug 09 22:03:18 <doll>	i dont co sider myself a delagate on oceania, merely an interetsed and active participant in this relam
Aug 09 22:03:21 <doll>	realm
Aug 09 22:03:30 <allan_x>	me too doll
Aug 09 22:03:32 <wowi>	doll: indeed as do it
Aug 09 22:03:33 <zl2tod>	I'm not on the list ... I'm resistant to layers of bureaucracy
Aug 09 22:03:37 <gdm>	ok, can ppl be quiet a sec
Aug 09 22:03:43 *	and_ is falling asleep
Aug 09 22:04:02 <and_>	what buracracy? if yr not on the list how do you know!
Aug 09 22:04:07 <allan_x>	:)
Aug 09 22:04:07 <gdm>	zl2tod to respond, then we need to agree next meeting date, then allan_x to talk about urban art doco
Aug 09 22:04:09 <gdm>	please!!
Aug 09 22:04:19 <gdm>	zl2tod: go :-)
Aug 09 22:04:32 *	shayne hands gdm the hammer of justice
Aug 09 22:04:39 -->	guest303 has joined #oceania
Aug 09 22:04:47 <zl2tod>	and_ list upon list upon list, and process upon process upon process, that sort of bureacracy
Aug 09 22:04:51 <guest303>	got disconnected again.
Aug 09 22:05:13 <guest303>	Does oceania have a decision making process purely on the main list?
Aug 09 22:05:25 <gdm>	guest303 please be quiet 
Aug 09 22:05:29 <doll>	i honestly have no sense of bureaucracy in this oceanic gathering or lists
Aug 09 22:05:30 <wowi>	zl2tod: unfortunately this is being 'organised'.. i dont like it but it helps 
Aug 09 22:05:31 <gdm>	zl2tod is speaking
Aug 09 22:05:38 <guest303>	guest303 is kimci is guest
Aug 09 22:05:43 <gdm>	i know
Aug 09 22:05:51 <allan_x>	[fuck beaurocracy]
Aug 09 22:06:03 <gdm>	please shutup and stop taking the discussion off topic, i'm getting frustrated with it
Aug 09 22:06:07 <guest303>	accountability can be your saviour
Aug 09 22:06:14 <and_>	my god, we've all gone insane :)))))
Aug 09 22:06:18 *	wowi pats gdm on the back: gd facilitating
Aug 09 22:06:20 <gdm>	zl2tod: more to say?
Aug 09 22:06:38 <zl2tod>	not really - what I've said here will do fine
Aug 09 22:06:53 <wowi>	ok.. cheers for the input :)
Aug 09 22:06:54 <guest303>	where can I find if oceania list can make binding decisions without member group ratification
Aug 09 22:07:00 <and_>	i think we are all getting tired and should wrap up
Aug 09 22:07:05 <allan_x>	ratify?
Aug 09 22:07:10 <wowi>	i'm off
Aug 09 22:07:12 <gdm>	ok. thanks. discussion to be continued on imc-oceania, zl2tod to inform aotearoa network and then comments feedback on imc-oceania
Aug 09 22:07:16 <guest303>	is there a formal delegates structure? like in the communication list
Aug 09 22:07:18 <allan_x>	what does that mean to anarchists? :)
Aug 09 22:07:25 <--	guest has quit (Killed (zl2 (ghost)))
Aug 09 22:07:26 <gdm>	guest303
Aug 09 22:07:26 <wowi>	al et al artdoco crew: tell me what's sed weds
Aug 09 22:07:31 <gdm>	i have asked u to stop
Aug 09 22:07:32 <guest303>	I am an anarchist [mutualist]
Aug 09 22:07:42 <wowi>	cyas!!
Aug 09 22:07:45 <gdm>	and i'm gonna kick u if u keep disrupting
Aug 09 22:07:45 *	and_ abandoning ship of fools
Aug 09 22:07:47 <doll>	byee
Aug 09 22:07:53 <--	doll has quit (Quit: doll yoko drifts back to the pond of dead girls)
Aug 09 22:07:55 <quoll>	  ciao
Aug 09 22:07:56 <gdm>	wait: next meeting date first please?
Aug 09 22:07:58 <--	quoll has quit (Quit: Chatzilla 0.9.64b [Mozilla rv:1.7/20040614])
Aug 09 22:08:05 <and_>	in one months time
Aug 09 22:08:28 <guest303>	We can not make binding decisions giving another forum [the list] decision making powers without ratification [e.g from the conference]
Aug 09 22:08:30 <--	wowi has quit (Quit: Client exiting)
Aug 09 22:08:38 <--	gdm has kicked guest303 from #oceania (guest303)
Aug 09 22:08:44 <gdm>	he was warned
Aug 09 22:08:48 <allan_x>	yay!
Aug 09 22:08:52 <and_>	yay!
Aug 09 22:09:02 <allan_x>	art doco: i'm in melb this weekend
Aug 09 22:09:06 <and_>	cool
Aug 09 22:09:07 <gdm>	next meeting date??>?
Aug 09 22:09:12 <allan_x>	wanna catch up with melb indy crew 
Aug 09 22:09:13 <gdm>	please give a date now
Aug 09 22:09:15 <and_>	i propose 6th of sept
Aug 09 22:09:15 <gdm>	and_ ?
Aug 09 22:09:19 <and_>	that's amonday
Aug 09 22:09:26 <gdm>	ok, any dissent??
Aug 09 22:09:34 <pabs>	isn;t that the tech meeting
Aug 09 22:09:41 <and_>	don't knoiw
Aug 09 22:09:43 <zl2tod>	from what I can see what guest was saying WAS relevant to the discussion
Aug 09 22:09:51 <and_>	should we just do it the week after tech meeting
Aug 09 22:10:15 <gdm>	we need to be able to propose a date to the list, zl2tod
Aug 09 22:10:15 <allan_x>	who WAS guest 303 anyway?
Aug 09 22:10:17 <takver>	Conflict: anarres meeting on 6th sept
Aug 09 22:10:19 <gdm>	kimci
Aug 09 22:10:32 <gdm>	ok, whatabout setpt 13, also a monday?
Aug 09 22:10:38 <allan_x>	ah ok
Aug 09 22:10:38 <and_>	13th is good
Aug 09 22:10:55 <and_>	there will be tech and asia-pacific meetings inbetween in anycase
Aug 09 22:10:58 *	shayne hmmmmms.
Aug 09 22:11:37 *	takver nods - 13th sept is okay
Aug 09 22:11:41 <gdm>	any disagreement or comments??
Aug 09 22:12:20 <gdm>	2 minutes - if no dissent, we talk briefly about urban art doco and anyone who needs to sleep can go
Aug 09 22:12:39 *	and_ needs to sleep
Aug 09 22:12:46 *	takver all hears
Aug 09 22:12:48 <allan_x>	seeyas... i'm over it. thought there was gonna be talk of oceania urban art doc. have a good one!
Aug 09 22:12:56 <and_>	4 hour meetings are not good for people's sanity
Aug 09 22:12:58 <pabs>	allan_x: wed
Aug 09 22:13:05 <allan_x>	email me allanx indymedia org
Aug 09 22:13:08 <--	allan_x has quit ()
Aug 09 22:13:18 <and_>	gdm : you did good facilitating a hard meeting
Aug 09 22:13:21 <and_>	thanks
Aug 09 22:13:30 *	shayne claps
Aug 09 22:13:40 <gdm>	no probs: thanks and_ 
Aug 09 22:13:48 <gdm>	and thank you for being supportive everyone
Aug 09 22:13:54 <gdm>	sorry if i was mean to ya's ;-)
Aug 09 22:13:59 <and_>	will catch you all soon
Aug 09 22:14:00 <shayne>	prick ;) ;)
Aug 09 22:14:12 <shayne>	hey, can next meeting we look at introducing some sort of protocol
Aug 09 22:14:17 <shayne>	where the meeting is moderated
Aug 09 22:14:23 <--	and_ has quit (Quit: Leaving)
Aug 09 22:14:27 <shayne>	to make it a bit more sane
Aug 09 22:14:51 <shayne>	that kinda hurt my brain a little 
Aug 09 22:14:57 <gdm>	dunno if that'd work shayne?
Aug 09 22:15:02 <gdm>	we need some good notes from it
Aug 09 22:15:02 <takver>	kimci prides himelf on being a trained mediator
Aug 09 22:15:15 <gdm>	takver: yes: so why doesnt' he understand??
Aug 09 22:15:59 <takver>	maybe he is good at mediating others problems, not when he is involved
Aug 09 22:16:11 <gdm>	yes: probably same as all of us
Aug 09 22:16:18 <gdm>	good that they are going on frieday, tho
Aug 09 22:16:23 <gdm>	(if they go!)
Aug 09 22:16:47 <gdm>	btw, the meeting is over now
Aug 09 22:17:04 <takver>	I hope Fridays mediation works, but I'm a little pessimistic