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Log of IRC meeting on TranslationTool on 27th Aug 2003
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Session Start: Wed Aug 27 08:49:32 2003 Session Ident: #translationtool | ||||||||
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12> Channel Modes: 11+tn 12> Created on 11Wednesday, August 27th, 2003 12at 118:49am | |||||||
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12 Channel Modes: 11+tn 12 Created on 11Wednesday, August 27th, 2003 12at 118:49am | |||||||
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16:48 * Topic is 'this evening: irc-meeting! 6 pm GMT/ 8pm CEST, here' 16:48 * Set by linksrhein!~stw@p50890B44.dip0.t-ipconnect.de on Wed Aug 27 12:13:01 | ||||||||
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12> Channel Modes: 11+tn 12> Created on 11Wednesday, August 27th, 2003 12at 1112:11pm 16:58 <@linksrhein> hi 16:58 <@linksrhein> ausgepennt? ;-) | |||||||
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12 Channel Modes: 11+tn 12 Created on 11Wednesday, August 27th, 2003 12at 1112:11pm 16:58 @linksrhein hi 16:58 @linksrhein ausgepennt? ;-) | |||||||
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17:03 ] A-mann^out (irc@localhost) is now known as AlsterWasserMann? 18:09 ] linksrhein «~stw@p50890B44.dip0.t-ipconnect.de» has Quit iRC (ChatZilla? 0.8.31 [Mozilla rv:1.4/20030624]11) 18:48 ] ab-tired (~ab@82-41-75-178.cable.ubr10.edin.blueyonder.co.uk) has joined. 12«112 people12» | ||||||||
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18:48 ] ab-tired is also in channels 12«11 @#uk 12» 18:48 ab-tired h 18:48 ab-tired see you later 19:05 AlsterWasserMann me too :) | |||||||
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19:28 ] linksrhein is also in channels 12«11 #de 12» 19:28 ab-tired huhu linksrheini 19:28 ab-tired ;-) 19:28linksrhein huhu :-) 19:29 linksrhein ich muss gleich nochmal raus und mich neu einloggen 19:29 linksrhein hab son komischen XChat client ausprobiert 19:30 linksrhein wg. ssl und so 19:30 linksrhein mag ich aber grad gar nich 19:32 linksrhein bis gleich | |||||||
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19:45 19:46 19:48 19:56 | |||||||
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19:45 linksrhein ... phone ... 19:46 luna sorry? 19:48 linksrhein back 19:56 linksrhein ab: warst du die erste hier? | |||||||
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19:59 luna hi st3 19:59 linksrhein hi :-) | |||||||
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20:00 * st3 in a dark place sat on a pack of cookies for dogs typin on a mac keyboard remapped us | ||||||||
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20:00 20:00 20:00 20:00 20:01 20:01 20:01 20:01 20:01 20:01 20:01 20:02 | |||||||
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20:00 st3 hi all :) 20:00 st3 so, somebody told me there are 8 o clock 20:00 st3 is it right? 20:00 linksrhein yes 20:01 st3 are is 20:01 st3 or are 20:01 st3 i dunno 20:01 st3 :) 20:01 luna yes! but nobody here :-( 20:01 st3 i'll call blicero and look for maria... 20:01 st3 just a moment 20:02 linksrhein what shall we do with the op-rights? | |||||||
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20:03 st3 hrm 20:03 linksrhein haha 20:03 st3 i think that since we're in 4/5 20:03 st3 this is not a problem | |||||||
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20:04 linksrhein i would like to set topics etc. 20:05 st3 so nobody has the op 20:05 st3 hrm 20:06 st3 we could all exit and reenter? 20:06 st3 no we couldn't 20:06 st3 cause amann is shopping 20:06 luna topics. 20:06 st3 ok 20:06 st3 so we should begin? 20:06 luna why reenter? 20:07 st3 to get the op 20:07 st3 but ok, let's begin 20:08 st3 so, i saw that the first topic should be the collaboration with italy imc 20:08 luna 1what's an op? 20:08 linksrhein moment 20:08 st3 (st3 stacks) 20:09 st3 ok 20:09 st3 luna: operator status 20:09 luna @st3: first come first serve? 20:09 luna :-) 20:10 linksrhein shall we introduce us to each other first? (interest in translation work...) 20:10 st3 ok 20:10 st3 who begins? 20:10 luna ok 20:10 luna linky! 20:10 st3 yup 20:11 linksrhein i guess thats me :) 20:11 linksrhein so 20:11 linksrhein as always 20:11 linksrhein german translation work member 20:11 linksrhein customizer of the translation tool 20:11 linksrhein end 20:11 linksrhein :) 20:11 luna me? 20:11 linksrhein yes 20:12 luna also member of indy-de 20:12 luna translations from and to english, very poor spanisch 20:12 luna that's it 20:12 st3 me 20:12 luna :-) 20:12 st3 i'm from imc italy 20:12 st3 hrm 20:12 st3 italy techie 20:13 st3 translations from/to english french italian 20:13 st3 very poor spanish 20:13 st3 and no more than 30 words of german :D 20:13 st3 that's all i think 20:14 st3 oh 20:14 st3 i'm the guy 20:14 st3 that should translate zope into italian 20:14 st3 that's all 20:14 linksrhein hehe 20:14 st3 :D 20:14 linksrhein a-man stillshopping? 20:15 st3 and ab so tired? 20:15 linksrhein ab dont know 20:15 linksrhein maybe i say something about her? 20:15 st3 ok 20:16 linksrhein she is from imc uk/scotland 20:16 linksrhein translates sometimes from german to english | |||||||
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20:16 20:16 20:16 20:17 20:17 20:17 20:18  do you want to introduce yourself / your interes in translation work?20:19 20:19 20:19 20:20 20:21 20:21 20:21 20:21 20:21 20:21 20:21 20:21 20:21 20:21 20:22 20:22 20:22 20:22 20:22 20:23 20:23 20:23 20:23 20:23 20:23 20:23 20:23 20:23 20:23 20:24 20:24 20:24 20:24 20:24 20:25 20:25 20:25 20:25 20:25 20:26 20:26 20:26 20:26 20:27 20:28 20:28 20:28 20:28 20:29 20:29 20:29 20:29 20:30 20:30 20:31 20:31 20:31 20:32 20:32 20:32 20:33 20:33 20:34 20:34 20:35 20:35 20:36 20:37 20:37 | |||||||
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20:16 cpunkpunk hi there 20:16 linksrhein (german native speaker) 20:16 cpunkpunk cpnk from it/uk here 20:17 linksrhein already uses the translation tool (has mod rights) 20:17 linksrhein visited a zope lecture yesterday :-) 20:17 linksrhein end 20:18 linksrhein hi cpnk do you want to introduce yourself / your interes in translation work?20:19 cpunkpunk yup sorry to interrupt ya i didn't know u were in the middle of something :) 20:19 cpunkpunk and yep im interested in helping this translation tool 20:19 cpunkpunk i mean i give my eng-ita ita-eng skill available :) 20:20 cpunkpunk or whatever else is needed 20:21 luna end? 20:21 st3 ok 20:21 st3 so i think we can now begin 20:21 cpunkpunk how is the development of this tool going? 20:21 cpunkpunk sorry yes END :) 20:21 st3 isn't it? 20:21 luna whats the topics 20:21 cpunkpunk consenso/agree 20:21 st3 cpunkpunk: zope is a tool, written in perl 20:21 linksrhein topic proposals were http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Devel/TranslationIrcMeeting1 20:22 linksrhein st3: in python 20:22 st3 yep 20:22 st3 oh sorry :D 20:22 luna thanks 20:22 st3 cpunkpunk: you can see it in action at translations.indymedia.org 20:23 cpunkpunk it's a human translation engine i guess... and not some automated bablefish crap right? 20:23 linksrhein correct 20:23 luna first collaboration: how can we all use and help in the work with the tool? 20:23 st3 no, la prima che hai detto :) 20:23 cpunkpunk k 20:23 ab-tired hey I am also here 20:23 ab-tired very sleepy though 20:23 luna hi 20:23 linksrhein :) 20:23 st3 ab-tired take some guarana 20:24 st3 :) 20:24 ab-tired Anarchobabe from ImcScotland?/ImcUK 20:24 cpunkpunk ab-tired: u in london? maybe? 20:24 ab-tired translating engl/german german/engl 20:24 ab-tired Edinburgh :-) 20:25 cpunkpunk anyway so ppl post their article that wanna have translated, stating into which language they do want it and who ever is available would book it to do? am i right? 20:25 ab-tired and understand a bit of french, therefor guess a bit of spanish/italian occassionally ;-) 20:25 cpunkpunk ab-tired: good good 20:25 ab-tired end 20:25 st3 cpunkpunk smtg like that 20:26 st3 but i'd propose some extra ftr 20:26 st3 s 20:26 cpunkpunk propose or develop? :) 20:26 luna what? 20:27 cpunkpunk question: r we gonna coordinate ea by ML or something? 20:28 linksrhein ML? 20:28 cpunkpunk cause i dunno yet how the all thing is set up but i guess it would be cool to recive emails when a translation is needed and when somebody is gonna do it 20:28 cpunkpunk ML = mailing list 20:28 st3 cpunkpunk maybe both 20:29 linksrhein for all the features see: http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Devel/TranslationTool 20:29 linksrhein email notification is possible 20:29 st3 linksrhein: were you managing to use translations@lists.indymediaSTOPSPAM.org wasn't it? 20:29 luna actually there is such a thing. but the last days i didn't received such mails anymore. but it is very silent anyway. 20:30 linksrhein st3: yes, for management, not for thr translation work itself 20:30 linksrhein luna: the reason is ... 20:31 cpunkpunk well maybe a majordomo ftr could post email w/ articles to who is available to translate it into that language from that language 20:31 linksrhein i tried to repair the header of the mails 20:31 linksrhein and switched it off for a while 20:32 cpunkpunk once an article is posted i meant.. or r we all supposed to check it online? 20:32 luna i check it online regularly 20:32 cpunkpunk i c 20:33 linksrhein it should be possible to send notifications to different lists, depending on language/topic criteria maybe 20:33 luna but if you click to "to do" then you have all the work listed there and pick up what you want and if you want 20:34 linksrhein further: there are some rss-feeds 20:34 cpunkpunk luna: i c 20:35 st3 i have to go just a moment 20:35 luna ok. should we now begin with the topics? or are there other general questions 20:36 st3 net matters :/ 20:37 linksrhein st3: before you go ... 20:37 linksrhein i ve seen lots of translation work going on on www-it | |||||||
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20:37 linksrhein are ppl there interested to use the translation tool? 20:38 linksrhein end | |||||||
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20:38 * Anna is still busy, but will be here in a while.. | ||||||||
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20:39 20:39 20:39 20:39 | |||||||
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20:39 luna ok. any quetschions? 20:39 linksrhein st3? 20:39 luna hmmm 20:39 linksrhein do they wait for translation of the gui? | |||||||
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20:39 cpunkpunk linksrhein: i think he's gone 20:40 linksrhein shit 20:40 cpunkpunk but back soon 20:40 linksrhein to slow :-) 20:41 luna okay. 2 new participants! do you want to introduce yourself? 20:41 st3 linksrhein ppl interested was 2 20:41 st3 and not here now for some problems 20:42 AlsterWasserMann hi! i'm from imc germany, co-founder of the DispatchWorkingGroup?, trying to improve the dispatch process, and an indymedia noobee. 20:43 linksrhein anna? 20:44 AlsterWasserMann [20:38] * Anna is still busy, but will be here in a while.. 20:44 linksrhein so, we go on in the meanwhile? 20:45 AlsterWasserMann i can't say 20:45 luna we should. she said she's busy? 20:45 AlsterWasserMann yes 20:46 AlsterWasserMann 7 mins ago she said so 20:46 luna okay. how to begin now? cooperation? 20:46 cpunkpunk guys i gotta rush in a bit for a bit, im available for eng-ita ita-eng and to activly work on the translationtool, i'll have word w/ st3 later on if im not joining here later... i nthe meanwhile stay in touch.. 20:46 cpunkpunk c ya later and sorry to interrupt again :) 20:46 cpunkpunk st3: a dopo | |||||||
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20:47 luna okay 20:47 luna eeem 20:49 luna actually it's clear how we could work together, no? just using the tool together. 20:49 linksrhein so maybe cooperation with imc uk now? 20:49 AlsterWasserMann deid i miss much so far? 20:49 luna maybe we should coordinate more often via the lists 20:49 luna @alsterman: nothing! punk has left. nothing else 20:50 luna ab? 20:51 AlsterWasserMann thx luna 20:51 linksrhein not here 20:51 luna has she left? 20:51 linksrhein dont know 20:51 - [ab-tired] FINGER 20:52 luna as far as i know there is no contact to any uk-translators. i may be wrong. 20:52 linksrhein you mean besides ab? 20:53 luna sure. 20:53 linksrhein ab seams not to be with us, so maybe we try with the topic outreach? 20:53 luna linksrhein: you wrote an email to various lists. any responds? 20:54 linksrhein no 20:54 st3 sorry i'm in trouble with the net here again 20:54 st3 linksrhein we forwarded it on italy list 20:54 st3 anyway 20:54 st3 gaietta and blicero seemed to be interested in 20:55 linksrhein yes :-) 20:55 linksrhein just ppl coming to the irc channel asking questions ... 20:55 st3 so... what do u wanna do? 20:55 linksrhein neo , maria wanetd to contact barcelona 20:55 st3 i would propose 20:56 AlsterWasserMann do you have a topic list or agenda for this chat? 20:57 AlsterWasserMann or is it first come first serve? 20:57 linksrhein st3: so we sapmmed global lists once 20:57 linksrhein we could do it a second time 20:57 luna http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Devel/TranslationIrcMeeting1 20:57 linksrhein design banners 20:58 linksrhein make an entry to cieties.inc 20:58 linksrhein tell voluntee.indymedia.org | |||||||
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20:58 ] gaietta is also in channels 12«11 #indymedia 12» 20:58 AlsterWasserMann thx luna 20:58 gaietta hi all 20:59 AlsterWasserMann hi gaietta 20:59 linksrhein hi :-) 21:00 linksrhein please introduce yourself :-) 21:00 gaietta ? 21:00 st3 i would propose 21:00 st3 to do this meeting 21:00 st3 another time 21:00 st3 recontacting more ppl 21:00 st3 and use the mailing list in the mean while 21:00 st3 do you agree? 21:01 st3 linksrhein ok ok 21:01 st3 you r right 21:01 AlsterWasserMann why give up a meeting with 7 people on it? 21:01 st3 right 21:01 gaietta we could discuss and fix another irc imeeting 21:01 gaietta if there aren't enough ppl 21:02 luna we just have to BEGIN! 21:03 linksrhein and we have work to do already now 21:03 linksrhein for example 21:03 linksrhein who designs a banner? 21:03 linksrhein who makes a draft for the outreach-emal? 21:04 st3 ok ok 21:04 st3 you r right 21:04 linksrhein who tells volunteers.indymedia.org? 21:04 luna thats new to me! 21:04 linksrhein they direct volunteers to the right contacts 21:05 AlsterWasserMann linksrhein for the outreach email, you may remeber we had the same topic on the dispatch chat yesterday. maybe we could add a few sentences to our mail and ypu could add a few of us to yours ? or we could combine it again 21:05 linksrhein sure 21:06 linksrhein so a-man i i write this email and send it to global lists 21:06 linksrhein a-man and i 21:06 luna and what's it all about the new banner? 21:06 AlsterWasserMann we should do it the same way as yesterday, just with more time in advance and bounce mail handling and stuff 21:06 linksrhein ok 21:06 AlsterWasserMann yeah, what about the banner? where will it be displayed? 21:07 st3 sorry g2g noe 21:07 linksrhein i remember anna once made the proposal to ask (ithink) init to design a banner 21:07 st3 ill be back in a while | |||||||
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21:07 linksrhein just for the startpage of different imcs | |||||||
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21:08 luna furchtbar! 21:08 luna jetzt hocken die deutschen allein in einem internationalen chat! juhu! 21:08 AlsterWasserMann oic 21:08 linksrhein but maybe its enough to have an entry in the cities.inc list | |||||||
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12«11chrisc 12in11 #uk 12at11 21:08 12» AlsterWasserMann?: i speak no other languages... but i'm following your progress with interest :-) | ||||||||
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21:09 linksrhein this is already prepared. 21:09 linksrhein just a mail to blicero and we will be added 21:11 linksrhein so again: maybe we stop the meeting? 21:11 luna what about volunteer.indy.org? i just visited the site but it's not available 21:12 linksrhein for me it works 21:12 linksrhein http://volunteer.indymedia.org/ 21:14 linksrhein i'm quite disappointed at the moment 21:15 luna me too. eigentlich können wir auch wieder deutsch schreiben, oder? 21:15 linksrhein too many ppl are here and are not here at the same time | |||||||
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21:15 ] Boduognat is also in channels 12«11 #indymedia #sfkids 12» 21:15 Boduognat hello.. 21:15 luna hi 21:16 AlsterWasserMann omg, a foreigner! 21:16 Boduognat What is the meaning of this? 21:16 linksrhein hi :-) 21:16 Boduognat yeah.. 21:16 Boduognat "Old Europe" here.. 21:16 Boduognat the "Axis of Weasels".. ring a bell? 21:16 luna sorry? 21:16 Boduognat never mind.. | |||||||
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21:17 luna alles klar! 21:17 linksrhein so we stop the meeting and leave for private talks? 21:18 luna hmm 21:20 luna we could first discuss the content and the distribution of this invitation mail 21:21 linksrhein ok, any proposals? 21:22 linksrhein luna? 21:22 luna a short description on how the tool works, that we want to get it international, that it's a great possibility to cooperate 21:22 luna yes 21:22 linksrhein ok | |||||||
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21:24 luna maybe, that a little response would be great and if anybody is interested in an irc chat, so that we could all plan it in advance 21:24 luna maybe it works better that way. 21:25 linksrhein st3: we started collecting what should be written in the outreach mail 21:25 linksrhein ok 21:25 luna maybe put the topics into the mail and not as a link, so that they can see, what it's all about! 21:25 linksrhein good | |||||||
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21:26 luna emmm 21:27 luna maybe pointing out, that its a possibility to SPREAD news all over the world. there could be so many different nationalities working on the tool. something happens in india, one posts it on the tool, someone picks it up, anybody else sends it to imcs in usa maybe. | |||||||
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21:28 * Anna is finally here, sorry | ||||||||
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21:28 st3 luna: i thought about smtg similar 21:28 luna cool 21:28 st3 i think that every imc could make a syndicate space 21:29 st3 with a mysql table, or a perl script 21:29 st3 that would tell translation system 21:29 st3 to send it articles about a topic in its language 21:30 linksrhein end? 21:30 luna to the tool or other way round? 21:30 st3 yes, end, xcuse me 21:31 st3 luna: to send articles to imc syndicate space 21:31 st3 or look for a way to retrieve sindycate news from the translation tool straight 21:31 st3 syndicate 21:32 luna would be great too! is that possible? 21:32 st3 i think so 21:32 st3 i could work on this 21:32 st3 we could do it with rdf/rss 21:33 st3 a method already used widely in indymedia 21:34 luna aha 21:34 linksrhein we should have in mind that we still dont have python programers in the project 21:35 st3 i have some c and php skills 21:35 st3 but no python :| 21:35 Anna isn't zapata the person to talk to about syndication? 21:35 st3 it's right but... we should not we trying to migrate to sf-active? 21:35 st3 i think it has similar features and works better for smtg 21:36 st3 for example, the way it's possible to admin it 21:36 st3 or the fact it's coded in php 21:36 linksrhein why not, every cms could implement this functionality 21:36 st3 cms==imc? 21:37 linksrhein content management system 21:37 st3 oh ok | |||||||
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21:37 21:37 21:37 21:37 21:37 21:37 21:38 21:38 21:38 21:38 21:39 21:39 21:39 21:40 21:40 21:40 21:40 21:40 21:41 21:41 21:42 21:42 21:43 21:43 21:43 21:44 21:45 21:45 21:46 21:47 21:47 21:47 21:48 21:48 21:48 21:48 21:49 21:49 21:49 21:49 21:49 21:50 21:50 | |||||||
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21:37 linksrhein who would do the migration? 21:37 st3 i could 21:37 st3 hrmm 21:37 st3 but 21:37 st3 sf-active works with mysql 21:37 st3 you know 21:38 st3 we could do it on stallman? 21:38 st3 i have no access at all on stallman 21:38 linksrhein end? 21:38 st3 so i dunno anything about the way the db works on it 21:39 st3 end, but i made some questions :) 21:39 linksrhein maybe to zapata? :-) 21:39 Anna is there anyone who can answer them? 21:40 st3 ps we could migrate it on ahimsa, i have access on it and ahimsa has mysql, but i dunno if you all agree 21:40 st3 (do you?) 21:40 Anna i have no clue what you're talking about :) 21:40 linksrhein me? 21:40 st3 you all :) 21:41 linksrhein anna: we speak about the migration to another codebase since more ppl could develop software in php than python 21:41 gaietta where is it at the moment' 21:42 Anna linksrhein, thanks. i meant that technically this is way beyond me.. 21:42 linksrhein my opinion ... 21:43 linksrhein if ppl exist who would migrate it ... 21:43 linksrhein they should start developing ... 21:43 linksrhein we use the translation tool as it is until the moment comes to switch 21:44 linksrhein than we use translations.indymedia.org with a new codebase 21:44 linksrhein end 21:45 linksrhein hello? 21:45 st3 hm 21:46 st3 i think we should get more feedback about a possible migration 21:47 luna actually nothing changes on the site. or am i wrong? 21:47 ab-tired In my opion we should try to link translation tool with twiki, so that single translations can become a cooperative projects, rather than one persons workloads 21:47 st3 what do ya mean for nothing? 21:48 AlsterWasserMann did i hear php? 21:48 st3 AlsterWasserMann?: yea you did 21:48 st3 =) 21:48 AlsterWasserMann yummy 21:49 st3 ab-tired: i think that twiki could be used for discussion and coordination about the tool 21:49 st3 AlsterWasserMann?: it's good. made with real honey! 21:49 st3 :) 21:49 ab-tired I think it could be of good use hwilst translating articles too, if it could be a bit more flexible? 21:49 ab-tired too tired to think sorry 21:50 ab-tired just for some futuristic utopias :-) 21:50 st3 ab-tired: think so =) | |||||||
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21:50 * AlsterWasserMann? loves php with honey but thinks it's even good without it. | ||||||||
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21:51 21:51 21:51 21:51 21:51 21:52 21:52 21:52 | |||||||
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21:51 st3 ab-tired: i think that twiki increase the work needed for admins and translators 21:51 st3 and gives nothing back 21:51 st3 really 21:51 linksrhein so a-man and st3: would you cooperate on developing a php/mysql system with similar / better functionality? 21:51 st3 furthermore, it's more direct and easy to use a sf-active translation tool 21:52 st3 linksrhein: sure i would 21:52 linksrhein a-man? 21:52 AlsterWasserMann well, theoretically for sure | |||||||
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21:52 ] gaietta «~x@62-101-126-208.fastres.net» has Quit iRC (Client Exiting11) | ||||||||
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21:52 21:53 21:53 21:53 21:53 21:53 21:54 21:54 21:54 | |||||||
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21:52 AlsterWasserMann but i want to develop the dispatch system as well 21:53 AlsterWasserMann so this might make me a bit short of free time 21:53 linksrhein :) 21:53 AlsterWasserMann but generally: yes 21:53 linksrhein for me it would meen ... 21:53 st3 i think that sf-active would be very good to do so 21:54 linksrhein to work less on documentation/layout/gui-translation in the meantime 21:54 st3 and i think that blicero and i could cooperate to hack it a bit and make it working for our needs 21:54 ab-tired st3. Idisagree strongly on that matter, but don't want to pursue differences in this issue any longer. twiki is good for interactivity; it will be good for translations and for every project posing heavy workload for one person but will make task much easier when more persons participate | |||||||
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21:56 * AlsterWasserMann? will make some tea now but be back in 5 mins to see how the discussion is developing | ||||||||
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21:56 linksrhein so do we have a decision on migration already? | |||||||
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21:57 * Anna wonders whether this is a structured discussion 'cause she has another idea to tell, later | ||||||||
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21:57 21:58 21:58 21:58 21:58 21:59 21:59 21:59 22:00 22:00 22:00 22:00 22:00 22:01 22:01 22:01 22:01 22:01 22:01 22:01 22:01 22:02 22:02 22:02 22:02 22:02 22:02 22:02 22:02 22:03 22:03 22:03 22:03 22:03 22:04 22:04 22:04 22:05 22:05 22:05 22:05 22:05 22:05 22:06 22:06 22:06 22:06 22:06 22:06 | |||||||
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21:57 linksrhein something like migration yes (asap) but codebase sf-active? 21:58 linksrhein or maybe mir? (looking to zapata) 21:58 Zapata hmmm 21:58 Zapata what's this about exactly... 21:58 Zapata I'm not really paying attention... 21:59 linksrhein actually i doesnt make sense to migrate to sf-active and later mir :-) 21:59 st3 ab-tired: i think that an user get very confused with a twiki system 21:59 Zapata what do you want to migrate to sf-active? 22:00 linksrhein translation tool funvtionality 22:00 st3 and it's not customizable and localizable as zope or sf-active would do 22:00 st3 Zapata: u can see it in action at translations.indymedia.or 22:00 st3 Zapata: u can see it in action at translations.indymedia.org 22:00 Zapata but is sf-active capable of doing such a thing? 22:01 st3 Zapata: sf-active offer same features as zope 22:01 st3 and adds more 22:01 Zapata ? 22:01 Zapata what features? 22:01 st3 a more powerful administration 22:01 st3 you don't know it? 22:01 Zapata more powerfull than ? 22:01 st3 than zope, o course 22:02 Zapata this current system is done in zope? 22:02 st3 yes it is 22:02 st3 i said 22:02 st3 Zapata: u can see it in action at translations.indymedia.org 22:02 st3 =) 22:02 Zapata I'm looking at it... 22:02 Zapata but... 22:02 Zapata can sf-active handle translations of articles? 22:03 st3 as this is currently done, sure 22:03 linksrhein its not about machine translation :-) 22:03 st3 i mean 22:03 Zapata how is it currently done? 22:03 Zapata links: I know... 22:04 st3 you can post an article (the article to be translated) and what we now call a comment (the article translation and whether it's to be revised other infos and so on) 22:04 Zapata ok... 22:04 ab-tired I just want to say that the workload for one person to translate an article might be too heavy sometimes, tresulting in key infomration not being translated, if there could be a system where you can drop your half translated articles with original and what you have already got other people could contribute to this already made effort 22:05 ab-tired might be technically be challenging to realise though :-) 22:05 Zapata ;-) 22:05 Zapata you're right... 22:05 st3 ab-tired: you r right... 22:05 Zapata "we" should plot out a path that eventually leads to a system with such features... 22:05 Zapata but for the relative short term, it'll be too much to ask... 22:06 st3 but anyway i don't think twiki it's the right solution for your problem 22:06 st3 we could make some hacks to sf-active 22:06 linksrhein ab: you can use wiki sysntax in arcticles already and work together on one article 22:06 Zapata twiki has some of those features... 22:06 st3 to make articles editable in a more structured mode 22:06 Zapata but lacks others... | |||||||
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22:06 * AlsterWasserMann? is back | ||||||||
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22:06 st3 and ppl sure could translate parts of an article as separated comments 22:07 st3 yea, at this point it would be quite hard to automatize for syndication 22:07 st3 but, with twiki it wouldn't be certainly easier 22:07 ab-tired for a translations indymedia we would need a bit more flexible ? cms? 22:08 ab-tired fro a user perspective it might be good to limit publishing to registered users only e.g. 22:08 ab-tired you might need a multiple language search function? 22:08 st3 you're talkin about twiki? 22:09 st3 ab-tired: sure i might need 22:09 ab-tired well no translation imc cms in general | |||||||
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22:09 * AlsterWasserMann? reading chat log from when he was gone | ||||||||
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22:09 22:09 22:10 22:10 22:11 22:11 22:11 22:11 22:11 22:11 22:11 22:11 22:12 22:12 22:12 22:12 22:12 22:12 22:12 22:13 22:13 22:13 22:14 22:14 22:14 22:14 22:14 22:14 22:14 22:14 22:14 22:14 22:15 22:15 22:15 ...22:16 22:16 22:17 22:17 22:17 22:17 22:18 22:18 22:18 22:18 22:18 22:18 | |||||||
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22:09 ab-tired well I shut up too tired 22:09 Anna i think twiki can be a problem when a lot of translations need to be done in a short time range. like during a summit 22:10 Anna i really like it, but we tried tha and it is difficult to keep things in order 22:10 Zapata did any of you btw look at the way biotechimc handles translations? 22:11 st3 Zapata: i did not 22:11 Anna i didn't.. 22:11 Zapata it's not exactly what you are looking for... 22:11 st3 why? 22:11 Zapata but it's like an imc site with the possibility of adding translations to articles... 22:11 Zapata http://biotechdev.mir.dnsalias.net/en/ 22:11 Zapata for the test version... (so you can safely try it out)... 22:11 Zapata I'm still not satisfied with how things look in admin 22:12 Anna ha! my idea that i'm trying to get throught wih´th for 1,5 years now! 22:12 Zapata ;-) 22:12 Anna thank you! 22:12 Zapata it was inspired by somewhat similar ideas by multiple people... 22:12 st3 yea, isn't really what we're lookin for 22:12 Zapata like you at the berling meeting... 22:12 Zapata and like imc ch, imc eh, and clara 22:13 Anna you have no idea how glad you are making me with this! 22:13 Zapata lol 22:13 Zapata I was kind of assuming clara had shown it to you... 22:14 Anna she didn't. but maybe she didn't know i had had this idea ages ago :) 22:14 Zapata hmmm 22:14 Zapata I think I told her... 22:14 Anna it's alright :) 22:14 Zapata ;-) 22:14 st3 ehr 22:14 st3 ... 22:14 linksrhein may i interrupt for structuring a bit? 22:14 Anna i'm sorry.. 22:14 st3 linksrhein: i'd be glad :) 22:15 linksrhein so.. 22:15 linksrhein we had the proposal to change to another codebase ... 22:15 linksrhein we then turned to tech-talk - maybe not interesting for all of us ...22:16 st3 ok 22:16 linksrhein maybe the techies could find themselves in another meeting ... 22:17 linksrhein decide on what codebase could be the best ... 22:17 linksrhein then .. 22:17 linksrhein we had the discussion twiki versus openposting 22:17 linksrhein no agreement was possible 22:18 st3 why? 22:18 linksrhein then we have anna who wanted to make a different point 22:18 st3 and 22:18 linksrhein end 22:18 luna i'm pro openposting 22:18 st3 oops excuse me for i've interrupted you | |||||||
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22:18 * st3 stacks | ||||||||
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22:18 | |||||||
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22:18 luna cause the postings appear on one spot. and everybody can find it. | |||||||
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22:18 * Zapata raises hand | ||||||||
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22:19 22:19 22:19 22:19 22:19 | |||||||
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22:19 luna twiki is really 22:19 luna yes 22:19 st3 the discussion about the codebase that we'd use 22:19 luna confusing from time to time. to find the page you want to work on. 22:19 st3 it doesn't seem to me just a tech-talk | |||||||
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22:19 * Anna is withdrawing her point - it was just mentioned :) | ||||||||
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22:19 22:19 22:20 | |||||||
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22:19 st3 we must consider our needs, our knowledge, the time we have to develop it 22:19 st3 end 22:20 st3 should i do the moderator? | |||||||
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22:20 * st3 stacks Zapata | ||||||||
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22:20 22:20 22:20 22:21 22:21 22:22 22:22 | |||||||
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22:20 Zapata well... 22:20 Zapata what I want to say is... 22:20 Zapata that you all should distinguish between short term goals and long term goals... 22:21 Zapata short term goals: a system to work with in the very near future... it won't be perfect, but it'll be just a bit better than nothing... 22:21 Zapata long term goals: a good system, fit to your needs... 22:22 Zapata by doing a codebase switch now, before you really know yourself what kind of system you need and how to get it, seems to me to be helping neither the short term goal, nor the long term goal... 22:22 Zapata end | |||||||
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22:22 * st3 raises hand 22:22 * st3 stacks st3 | ||||||||
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22:22 22:23 | |||||||
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22:22 st3 so... 22:23 st3 our short term goals | |||||||
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22:23 * AlsterWasserMann? raises hand | ||||||||
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22:23 22:23 22:23 22:23 22:23 22:24 22:24 22:24 22:24 22:25 | |||||||
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22:23 st3 includes also the localization of the tool 22:23 st3 that means 22:23 st3 we could use zope at the moment 22:23 st3 localize it 22:23 st3 and customize it better 22:24 st3 and ok 22:24 st3 but we should now consider 22:24 st3 our long term goals as well 22:24 st3 cause if we decide to migrate the tool, i'd begin to do it now 22:25 st3 end | |||||||
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22:25 * st3 stacks AlsterWasserMann? 22:25 * Zapata raises | ||||||||
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22:25 22:25 22:25 22:25 22:25 22:25 22:25 22:26 22:26 22:26 22:26 | |||||||
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22:25 AlsterWasserMann ok, Zapata already saod some 22:25 AlsterWasserMann of what i wanted to deal with 22:25 AlsterWasserMann but here itt is: 22:25 AlsterWasserMann i assume you will want to kick me around the channel for that but i wonder whether this discussion doesn't lead away from the really importing things. for sure it is important to select the codebase and technology for implementation of the system carefully. but i sometimes wonder what exactly is the idea behind the system and wheter we a re still keeping in mind a) what exactly ("translation" is a quite general term) the system is good for, b) whom the system is designed for, c) which scope it is supposed to have etc. i think these considerations need to be made before you actually discuss which codebase you selsct or move to. and it need to be discaussed over and over again to be sure you don't move away from your initial goals. 22:25 AlsterWasserMann (end) 22:25 Zapata alst: it was broken... 22:25 Zapata for, b) whom 22:26 Zapata was the last bit 22:26 AlsterWasserMann oh ok 22:26 AlsterWasserMann b) whom the system is designed for, c) which scope it is supposed to have etc. i think these considerations need to be made before you actually discuss which codebase you selsct or move to. and it need to be discaussed over and over again to be sure you don't move away from your initial goals. 22:26 AlsterWasserMann (end) | |||||||
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22:26 * st3 stacks Zapata | ||||||||
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22:26 | |||||||
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22:26 Zapata ok... | |||||||
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22:26 * st3 raises hand | ||||||||
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22:27 22:27 | |||||||
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22:27 Zapata my concern is, that switching codebases now, will take a lot of effort... 22:27 Zapata if you don't know really what you want at the long term, that effort may be wasted: you may have to switch again etc... | |||||||
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22:27 * linksrhein nods | ||||||||
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22:27 22:27 | |||||||
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22:27 Zapata once again, these remarks are only in general, I haven't really been following this groups work very well... 22:27 Zapata end | |||||||
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22:27 * st3 stacks st3 | ||||||||
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22:28 22:28 22:28 22:28 22:28 22:29 22:29 | |||||||
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22:28 st3 i think, talking about what AlsterWasserMann? said 22:28 st3 that we have already discussed 22:28 st3 what our goals related to the term 'translation' are 22:28 st3 but ok 22:28 st3 we sure haven't discussed the c) point 22:29 st3 so we could begin now 22:29 st3 end | |||||||
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22:29 * st3 stacks linksrhein 22:29 * AlsterWasserMann? thinks you prolly defined it but i just didn't read enough ;) | ||||||||
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22:29 | |||||||
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22:29 linksrhein why? | |||||||
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22:29 * AlsterWasserMann? raises hand | ||||||||
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22:29 | |||||||
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22:29 st3 oops | |||||||
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22:30 * st3 stacks AlsterWasserMann? | ||||||||
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22:30 22:30 22:30 22:30 22:30 22:31 22:31 22:31 | |||||||
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22:30 AlsterWasserMann is i my turn alrady? 22:30 st3 yes 22:30 AlsterWasserMann well, what i wanted to say with my abc 22:30 AlsterWasserMann is (beside others) 22:30 AlsterWasserMann that i think it would be useful to have a direct interoperability with 22:31 AlsterWasserMann all the CMS's generally used by IMCs 22:31 AlsterWasserMann meaning sf-active and mir 22:31 AlsterWasserMann or whatever may come up inthe futre | |||||||
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22:31 * st3 shakes his hands (it means 'i agree' in imc italy :) | ||||||||
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22:32 22:32 | |||||||
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22:32 AlsterWasserMann i think it's important to keep an eye on the user, who would be the trasnbaltator, and another eye on simplicity and the several IMCs beneficials caused by an interface to the transaltion system 22:32 AlsterWasserMann (end) | |||||||
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22:33 * st3 raises and stacks himself | ||||||||
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22:33 22:33 22:33 22:33 22:33 22:33 | |||||||
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22:33 st3 so 22:33 st3 rdf/rss syndication system 22:33 st3 offers all the features you talked about 22:33 st3 imho 22:33 st3 end 22:33 st3 ps sf-active provides them | |||||||
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1222:34 ] 11ERROR 12> 421: Unknown command:11 RAISES 22:34 * AlsterWasserMann? raises hand 22:34 * st3 stacks AlsterWasserMann? | ||||||||
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22:34 22:34 22:35 22:35 | |||||||
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22:34 AlsterWasserMann so interoperability with sf-active is already there? 22:34 AlsterWasserMann and what about mir? 22:35 AlsterWasserMann can you automatically trnasfer content into and from imcs running mir as well? 22:35 AlsterWasserMann (end) | |||||||
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22:35 * st3 raises and stacks 22:35 * Zapata raises | ||||||||
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22:35 22:35 22:35 22:36 22:36 22:36 22:37 22:37 | |||||||
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22:35 st3 it's very simple 22:35 st3 to get rdf feeds 22:35 st3 and display them 22:36 st3 it could be done with 3 lines of perls or so 22:36 st3 it could be done with 3 lines of perl or so 22:36 st3 i dunno anything about mir 22:37 st3 but i think the support could be coded in 2 days 22:37 st3 end | |||||||
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22:37 * st3 stacks Zapata | ||||||||
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22:37 22:37 22:37 22:37 22:37 22:37 22:37 22:37 22:38 22:38 | |||||||
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22:37 Zapata ok... 22:37 Zapata well... 22:37 Zapata that way of using rss syndication... 22:37 Zapata may well be considers very lacking for a lot of the people here... 22:37 Zapata may well be considerED very lacking for a lot of the people here... 22:37 Zapata mir also supports importing rss feeds into the db... 22:37 Zapata but... 22:37 Zapata also that is lacking... 22:38 Zapata what I think that is meant by alst, is to be able to have a random imc import an article into their newswire on that imc's request... 22:38 Zapata this requires quite a lot... | |||||||
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22:38 * AlsterWasserMann? nods | ||||||||
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22:38 | |||||||
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22:38 Zapata not so much from the translation system, but from all the other codebases... | |||||||
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22:39 * st3 raises | ||||||||
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22:39 22:39 22:39 | |||||||
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22:39 Zapata some of the mircoders have been thingking about making such a thing... and coordinating it with coders from other codebases... 22:39 Zapata but this will be quite complicated... and it will take plenty of time... 22:39 Zapata end | |||||||
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22:39 * st3 stacks st3 | ||||||||
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22:39 22:39 22:39 22:39 22:39 22:39 22:40 | |||||||
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22:39 st3 so 22:39 st3 for you 22:39 st3 there aren't other solutions 22:39 st3 than the one being coded by mir developers 22:39 st3 isn't it? 22:39 st3 and 22:40 st3 what about our short term goals? | |||||||
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22:40 * AlsterWasserMann? wonders whom "you" is 22:40 * ab-tired raises hand | ||||||||
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22:40 22:40 | |||||||
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22:40 st3 i think they could wait =) 22:40 st3 AlsterWasserMann? you Zapata | |||||||
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22:40 * Zapata notes that this idea is more or less originated by the mircoders, but it'll hopefully be a joint mir/sfa/dada project... | ||||||||
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22:40 22:40 | |||||||
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22:40 st3 ok 22:40 st3 end | |||||||
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22:40 * st3 stacks ab-tired | ||||||||
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22:41 22:41 22:42 22:42 22:42 22:42 22:43 | |||||||
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22:41 ab-tired dunno but would agree that an imc translation has other needs than a usual imc 22:41 ab-tired therefore in my opinion we should stick with what we have, figure out what we want and then prioritise our needs 22:42 ab-tired andd see then what system is the best for the adaptions which we would need to make 22:42 ab-tired and if anybody is willing and able to make 22:42 ab-tired and then trying to get the closest solution possible 22:42 ab-tired just on the organisatorial level on how to proceed 22:43 ab-tired with decision making | |||||||
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22:43 * Zapata completely agrees with ab | ||||||||
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22:43 22:43 | |||||||
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22:43 ab-tired ned 22:43 ab-tired sorry end | |||||||
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22:43 * st3 agrees | ||||||||
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22:44 | |||||||
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22:44 ab-tired Oh not ot forget to draw in the evalutation of the resources we have ;-) | |||||||
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22:44 * AlsterWasserMann? agrees to everything Zapata agrees to | ||||||||
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22:44 22:44 22:45 | |||||||
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22:44 Zapata lol 22:44 Zapata ;-) 22:45 AlsterWasserMann sometimes i just can't hold back ;) | |||||||
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22:45 * ab-tired raises hand 12«11mtoups 12in11 #tech 12at11 22:45 12» AlsterWasserMann?: yeah what's up? | ||||||||
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22:46 st3 oops | |||||||
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22:46 * st3 stacks ab-tired | ||||||||
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22:46 ab-tired dunno about zope but was told it is some aplication server- so maybe if we want to achieve short term goals there might be a better application for our needs than squishdot? but no clue about this tech stuff. 22:46 st3 :))) | |||||||
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22:47 * linksrhein raises hand :-) | ||||||||
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22:47 * st3 stacks linksrhein | ||||||||
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22:47 ab-tired ab stacks linksrhein 22:47 linksrhein :-) 22:47 linksrhein just for not to get confused ... 22:48 linksrhein squishdot is a weblog or bulltin bourd system, using zope capabilities 22:48 linksrhein its no cms 22:49 linksrhein if you use a cms, the application server might get much slower 22:49 linksrhein for the given purpose (see feature list) it was sufficient 22:50 linksrhein but if you take different zope-cms, you are at the same point, maybe as sf-active/mir 22:50 linksrhein end | |||||||
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22:50 ] blicero_lab (irc@localhost) has joined but is a 4Clone of Anna & AlsterWasserMann? & Zapata 12 12«118 people12» | ||||||||
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22:50 ] blicero_lab is also in channels 12«11 @#ahimsa 12» 22:50 AlsterWasserMann just with the difference you have no developers for it ;) 22:51 linksrhein zope communities :-) 22:51 st3 blicero_lab: introduce yourself now :) 22:51 AlsterWasserMann i mean customizer then 22:51 linksrhein but yes, u r right :-) 22:52 linksrhein end | |||||||
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22:52 * blicero_lab is blicero, official imc intnl bore, in particular italy imc bore | ||||||||
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22:52 ab-tired sorry if sb has already asked it before, but will the system we have now be able to cope with cancun/dsei/noborder days or will there be different systems used? | |||||||
| 22:53 * AlsterWasserMann? | ||||||||