Plaintext Log of 2004-02-04 Listwork Meeting

--- Log opened Wed Feb 04 17:06:11 2004
17:06 < pabs> ok
17:06 < pabs> basically the patches i had prepared were v broken
17:06 < pabs> i spent last night fixing em
17:06 < pabs> the osl & categories patches overlap lots
17:07 < epsas> 
17:03 < epsas> end.
17:07 < epsas> 
17:03 < jb->  . report scripts for lists moderated badly
17:07 < pabs> to top it all off i lost my internet
17:07 < pabs> last night
17:07 < pabs> anyway, mtoups is supposed to be doing the ssl
17:07 < epsas> (woops) http://www.threespeed.org/~epsas/listwork_meeting-2004-02-04
17:07 < pabs> patch
17:07 < micah> so there are still some patching you need to do?
17:07 < pabs> (doesn't seem to be here)
17:08 < pabs> i have a working version
17:08 < pabs> but it doesn't have the ssl patch
17:08 < micah> what patches are included?
17:08 < pabs> all the ones that are on sarai now
17:08 < pabs> (minus the lang changes)
17:08 < jb-> osl isnt there?
17:08 < pabs> yes that is in the massive patch
17:08 < micah> so todo is still language patches and ssl
17:09 < pabs> plus the default action patch
17:09 < pabs> lang changes are irrelevant
17:09 < pabs> imo
17:09 < micah> what do you mean?
17:09 < pabs> all they do is change some langs to use different names in the interface
17:10 < pabs> (which will have no translations)
17:10 < micah> ah, well some people had requested them, specifically the chinese one and one other that
matze put on?
17:10 < pabs> so they always show up as english
17:10 < pabs> that's not in mailman
17:10 < micah> really? I thought the one he put on worked
17:10 < pabs> thats in the python libs
17:10 < pabs> they change Defaults.py
17:11 < micah> I think he put korean on
17:11 < pabs> have a look at the sarai version
17:11 < micah> isn't Defaults.py part of mailman?
17:11 < pabs> ya
17:11 < pabs> chinese doesn't change that tho
17:11 < micah> ok, I dont really understand, but lets continue
17:12 < pabs> ok
17:12 < micah> so what should people do about patches in the future?
17:12 < micah> where to put them, process, etc.?
17:12 < pabs> patch needs to be split up, but that is for later
17:12 < pabs> hmm
17:12 < pabs> they should really be avail from the web
17:12 < pabs> maybe the wiki?
17:12 < jb-> ouch
17:13 < jb-> let's serve /var/lib/mailman/patches to the web, no?
17:13 < pabs> sounds good to me
17:13 < jb-> and use a simple naming scheme so that they're applied all the time in good order?
17:13 < micah> pabs: i'm pretty thrilled you've been pulling these patches together, but I'm worried if
you go away nobody will know how to continue your work (although I hope you dont go away!)
17:14 < pabs> :)
17:14 < pabs> i'v hons this year
17:14 < pabs> so i'll not go away
17:14 < micah> hons?
17:14 < pabs> honours
17:14 < micah> heh
17:14 < micah> usr/src/mailman-2.1.1/misc/KoreanCodecs-2.0.5.tar.gz
17:14 < micah> for example
17:14 < pabs> ah, didn't look at that
17:14 < micah> usr/src/mailman-2.1.1/misc/JapaneseCodecs-1.4.9.tar.gz
17:15 < pabs> jb: yep, they have a good naming scheme
17:15 < jb-> mmm
17:15 < mtoups> hola
17:15 < jb-> pabs: you mean as you have them now or as they are on sarai?
17:15 < micah> so, if someone gets the bright idea to add another patch, they should do what?
17:15 < pabs> mailman-2.1.4-off-site-lists-0.1.2-.patch for eg
17:15 < micah> contact pabs? :)
17:15 < pabs> :)
17:15 < mtoups> we could use rt or cvs or ....
17:15 < jb-> ah, i was thinking to enforce the order.
17:15 -!- pietro [irc@localhost] has joined #listwork
17:15 < pabs> till i get them split up at least micah
17:16 < pabs> jb: alphabetical works
17:16 < micah> pabs: sounds good
17:16 < jb-> numerical works better :p
17:16 < pabs> they conflict no matter what the order
17:16 < micah> mtoups: wanna say something about ssl patch?
17:16 < pabs> whateva
17:16 < jb-> pabs: ok
17:16 < jb-> but say for the future.
17:17  * epsas will bbiab (10min.)
17:17 < pabs> for the future? merge the osl & categories patches
17:17 < pabs> that will save lots of hassle
17:17 < jb-> anyway, anything cat can feed cat *.patch | patch -p0
17:17 < mtoups> yes, ssl: so it looks at first glance pretty easy to extend matze's ssl patch to apply t
o other scripts besides 'admin'
17:17 < mtoups> like "private" which is used for authenticating for private archives
17:18 < mtoups> it is also easy to make *everything* go over ssl (some people on the mailman list want t
his) but i suspect we do not want this
17:18 < mtoups> anyway, what do we want to go over ssl besides "admin" and "private" ?
17:18 < pietro> the create list page
17:19  * pabs points jb to the massive patch perth.indymedia.org/~pabs/mailman-2.1.4-indymedia.patch
17:19 < micah> it doesn't make much sense to have the user pasword page go over ssl if their password is
 emailed out to them
17:19 < epsas> mtoups - it might be useful for future applications (ie, mailing lists on secure smtp net
works, or pgp-signed mail, etc..)
17:19 < mtoups> this is true
17:19 < pabs> mtoups: which files does it touch?
17:20 < mtoups> Utils.py
17:20 < pabs> that's all, iirc?
17:20 < mtoups> yeah that's all we've patched so far and from my reading of utils.py, this will apply to
 any other cgi-bin scripts we want it to
17:21 < mtoups> of course i should test this :)
17:21 < mtoups> ( uml? :) )
17:21 < pabs> :)
17:21 < micah> ok, should w emove on?
17:21 < pabs> testing is v important
17:21 < pabs> ;)
17:21 < pabs> yup
17:21 < micah> ok
17:21 < micah> UML status
17:21 < micah> I kinda gave a brief status before the meeting started
17:21 < mtoups> but yeah i just added a case for the "private" script though as micah points out that's
not really sensitive data.  was there another case that we needed ssl for pabs?  msg me if so so we can
move on
17:22 < mtoups> (sorry, continue micah)
17:22 < micah> but I lookde at kropotkin to get UML setup, and found some difficulties, namely that we n
eed a new kernel and extra IPs and a bunch of setup that looked like a pain and would take a while
17:22 < micah> so I set things up on riseup's dev box where we have some UML machines already
17:22 < micah> so sarai.riseup.net exists and I am currently syncing data to it
17:23 < micah> I've got the root filesystem
17:23 < micah> all of /var except /var/log and /var/lib/mailman
17:23 < micah> and all of /usr
17:23 < micah> I am not bringing over /home because it is just mostly people's personal crap
17:23 < micah> and LARGE
17:23 < micah> oh yes, the only difference between sarai.riseup and sarai.indy will be
17:23 < micah> 1. IP
17:23 < micah> 2. kernel
17:23 < micah> 3. not all data will be there
17:24 < micah> so #1 and #2 are trivial
17:24 < micah> and not a problem, #3 we need to be careful and selective about
17:24 < micah> I was planning on bringing all of /var/lib/mailman over, but not the full archives, but t
he archives for a few lists, preferably some international ones
17:25 < pabs> what about some of /mailman - list databases etc?
17:25 < micah> I would probably bring all the list configs over
17:25 < micah> since they aren't that big
17:25 < micah> so /mailman/lists
17:25 < micah> but not /mailman/archives/*
17:25 < micah> not sure what to do about some of the temporary data (like held messages)
17:26 < micah> but if there is anything that I should bring that I'm not, let me know
17:26 < micah> you can't login to sarai.riseup until I reboot the machine, but it is really cool
17:26 < micah> it looks just like sarai
17:26 < micah> oh, also, the disks will be mounted on different devices
17:26 < micah> but that shouldn't be a big deal
17:27 < micah> I am also excluding copying some things, like /var/mail/listarchive which is huge and we'
ll talk about later
17:27 < micah> I am pretty sure the UML sarai will be ready tomorrow
17:27 < micah> the hold up is data syncing
17:27 < mtoups> hmm, so is it going to accept mail for sarai.riseup.net or sarai.indymedia.org ?
17:27 < micah> oh, so we'll have to be careful because we dont want to turn on postfix and the mailman c
rons or we will be sending out some duplicate stuff
17:28 < micah> well, it can be setup to accept mail for whatever we configure it to
17:28 < micah> but we should maybe make a list of things that we change
17:28 < micah> so that we can be very aware of any difference between the two machines
17:28 < micah> also, i can resync stuff much quicker if new things show up
17:28 < micah> 
17:28 < micah> any q's or should we go on?
17:29 < micah> going once
17:29 < micah> going twice
17:29 < micah> sold to the hairy man in the back!
17:29 < micah> ok, onto next agenda
17:29 < micah> debian package status
17:29 < micah> pabs/mtoups?
17:30 < pabs> simple as grab src from unstable, patch & compile
17:30 < micah> dependancies are all ok? so we don't have a cascading dependency issue?
17:30 < mtoups> well i just put 2.1.4 on lists.indypgh.org which runs stable
17:30 < micah> nice
17:30 < mtoups> and that had no dependency issues
17:30 < mtoups> BUT
17:30 < mtoups> it was running 2.1.2
17:30 < micah> oh oh, thats a big BUT
17:31 < mtoups> and i remember the 2.1.1 -> 2.1.2 upgrade requiring some tweakage
17:31 < mtoups> but i can handle it if it is necessary on sarai
17:31 < micah> ok
17:31 < mtoups> mostly build-depends, not install depends
17:31 < micah> sounds good
17:31 < mtoups> so we'll need the newer debhelper and crap like that
17:31 < pabs> easy then
17:31 < mtoups> easy to grab from, say, backports.org ... so yeah that's under control
17:31 < micah> then lets talk about actually doing this upgrade
17:32 < mtoups> yes
17:32 < micah> are we going to wait for the ssl patch, and then some testing on the UML?
17:32 < mtoups> the ssl patch is really simple, i don't think its risky to just go with it
17:32 < mtoups> i'm up for doing the upgrade tonight
17:32 < mtoups> or setting up the test env tonight
17:33 < micah> well, the UML is the test env no?
17:33 < mtoups> yeah
17:33 < pabs> well, i tested my massive patch on my home machine, you can be sure those functions work
17:33 < micah> so yeah, like I said before, the UML environment is setup, just sync'ing data
17:33 < pabs> cool
17:33 < micah> so are we saying that we don't really need the UML and could just do it on sarai?
17:34 < micah> i'm fine with that if there is a strong degree of confidence
17:35 < pabs> no, i want to test it more fully, with more eyes
17:35 < pabs> (could be hidden bugs)
17:35 < jb-> anyway, assuming we use the uml for patching in the future, we'll have to patch the mailman
 that's in anyway, so maybe let's start with that,,
17:36 < pabs> yup
17:36 < jb-> (dunno if that last one was clear ;p)
17:36 < micah> I'm not sure I follow
17:36 < micah> "the mailman that's in"?
17:36 < jb-> we will apply other patches, one day.  It will be better to test them somewhere.
17:37 < micah> ok
17:37 < jb-> we will test them in the uml, and for the test to be effective, we need normal mailman and
uml-mailman at the same patchlevel.
17:37 < micah> so we wait on doing stuff on sarai tonight?
17:37 < mtoups> well if all goes well we could do both.. ?
17:37 < mtoups> but if uml gives us problems, we stop and deal
17:37 < micah> ok
17:38 < mtoups> of course i dunno how convenient this is for europe/austrailia
17:38 < micah> so in that case we need to maybe set a time when we are going to do it?
17:38 < micah> and maybe send something out to imc-tech-announce
17:38 < pabs> it has to be during the day here, cause i have no net at home til i get dsl
17:39 < micah> ok, so should we pick a day? maybe this sunday?
17:39 < micah> pabs: or does it also have to be during the workweek?
17:39 < pabs> um, i think the lib here is open on sun
17:39 < pabs> brb, will check
17:40 < jb-> err
17:40 < micah> gotta love mailman upgrading at the library
17:40 < mtoups> heh
17:40 < jb-> it's extreme coincidence to have ppl from australia, europe and the americas at the same ti
me.
17:40 < micah> heh
17:40 < micah> thats what it was like with maffew involved
17:41 < mtoups> yeah, i kind of want to do as much as possible now... but i don't want to impose on othe
rs if that's bad
17:41 < micah> because he was in sydney
17:41 < jb-> if we do it on sunday, pabs will be pissed, i will be drunk and you'll be sleeping
17:41 < mtoups> haha
17:41 < jb-> or some other combination...
17:41 < micah> heh
17:41 < pabs> heh
17:41 < mtoups> and i'll be in boston probaly without network
17:41 < micah> mtoups: oh wait, you are talking about doing it now and not waiting for the UML?
17:41 < micah> mtoups: you are confusing me
17:42 < mtoups> micah: yeah i am giving mixed signals.  upgrade UML, then assuming nothing goes wrong on
 the UML, upgrade sarai
17:42 < micah> were you saying before that we do sarai.indy tonight, and then patch UML once it is ready
?
17:42 < micah> yes, but we can't upgrade UML tonight
17:42 < mtoups> doing both shouldn't be that much harder than doing one
17:42 < mtoups> oh because we're waiting on rsync?
17:42  * micah thinks mtoups didn't read what I said :)
17:42 < jb-> heh
17:42 < mtoups> i read "the UML is setup" and got too excited i guess :)
17:42 < pabs> lib is open sun 12.00pm - 5.00pm +8hrs
17:43 < mtoups> weekend might be better time to interrupt indy mail
17:43 < micah> 20:27 < micah> I am pretty sure the UML sarai will be ready tomorrow
17:43 < mtoups> though we'll want to turn off jb's search engine thing so that sarai isn't slow :)
17:43 < jb-> grr
17:44 < mtoups> well just if we're in the middle of an upgrade
17:44 < jb-> is someone using this, btw ? :p
17:44 < micah> jb: I've used it a number of times
17:44 < jb-> wow you're insane
17:44 < micah> so... we are doing the upgrade when?
17:44 < pabs> it seems to not understand the concept of private archives
17:45 < jb-> ah? i'll check this out.
17:45 < pabs> imc-perth for instance
17:45 < micah> so... we are doing the upgrade when?
17:45  * micah is impatient
17:46 < mtoups> i'm ok with tonight, i'm ok with later
17:46 < pabs> oh, i forgot, i have an activist meeting on sun
17:46 < micah> pabs?
17:46 < mtoups> we should do it in the next week or so, and the weekend is bad for me though if you guys
 are up fot it
17:47 < jb-> pabs: is imc-perth private since december?
17:47 < micah> well I know I am not good for too much longer, jetlag recovery still
17:47 < micah> so if we do it tonight then I'd probably have to cut out in 1.5 hours
17:48 < micah> and jb is at 1am where he is
17:48 < mtoups> i could put in time during the day tomorrow (us time) possibly
17:48 < jb-> (3am)
17:48 < micah> so I guess we can either do it tonight, if mtoups and pabs can pull through, and if jb ge
ts insomnia :)
17:48 < mtoups> so we could do uml then
17:49 < micah> 0k, we need a little more abiguity here
17:49 < mtoups> heh
17:50 < micah> how about we do it tonight, or tomorrow during the day, or this weekend?
17:50 < mtoups> well tomorrow during the day for me and micah is no good for pabs i assume
17:50 < mtoups> weekend is bad for me
17:50 < mtoups> tonight is good for me but bad for micah and jb
17:50  * micah pokes pabs
17:50 < pabs> now is ok for me
17:50 < micah> ok, well how about this
17:50 < micah> we shelve the rest of this blah blah and get started
17:51 < epsas> brb, smokes
17:51  * pabs cheers
17:51 < micah> if jb and I fade, then you guys are heros
17:51 < mtoups> yeah, we're all here which is an accomplishment in itself
17:51 < micah> and you get knighted tomorrow
17:51 < jb-> il'' fade.
17:51 < mtoups> besides the LAST mailman upgrade was way worse timing
17:51  * micah passes jb mate, cigarrette and a beer
17:51 < jb-> belh
17:51 < micah> yeah, it was more migration hell
17:52 < mtoups> oh i see how it is micah, you can hook jb up with mat
17:52 < micah> mtoups: heh
17:52 < micah> mtoups: I am actually kinda worried about that guy, he disappeared
17:52 < micah> too much mat
17:52 < micah> ok
17:52 < micah> lets get kernel mckrakin' then
17:53 < micah> the UML probably will just have to be resync'd rather than doing the upgrade again
17:53 < micah> because half will get sync'd as upgraded and half wont
17:53 < micah> so what has to be done then?
17:53 < micah> lets make a plan
17:53 < micah> 1. turn off mailman cron's
17:53 < micah> 2. turn off postfix
17:53 < micah> 3. turn off apache
17:53 < mtoups> yeah let's just try and be careful so that if something insane and unlikely happenswe ca
n go back to 2.1.1 just in case
17:53 < mtoups> i don't expect it, but...
17:54 < micah> 4. be careful
17:54 < micah> 5. dpkg -i mailman-2.1.4.deb
17:54 < micah> 6. patch -p1 < bigasspatch.patch
17:54 < pabs> eeke
17:54 < micah> 7. turn things on
17:54 < pabs> patch before dpkg -i
17:54 < mtoups> no... we patch before running debian/rules binary
17:54 < pabs> indeed
17:54 < micah> is there some finessing that has to be done in 5?
17:55 < mtoups> and let's patch and build the .deb before turning everything else off, actually
17:55 < pabs> yup
17:55 < micah> ok
17:55 < micah> thats yu guys
17:55 < mtoups> yep
17:55 < micah> should we do a shared screen session? ;)
17:55  * pabs asks ppl not helping directly with upgrades to go havest some lists from http://docs.indym
edia.org/view/Sysadmin/OffSiteLists
17:55 < mtoups> i'm grabbing 2.1.4 sources in /usr/src now
17:56 < micah> pabs: harvest in what way?
17:56 < pabs> sorry, grab the list name and url & description
17:56 < pabs> and categories if any
17:56 < micah> k, I'll work on that right now
17:57 < pabs> ibm,pietro,toya too?
17:57 < mtoups> micah, you want to set up the shared screen?
17:57 < mtoups> i haven't done that before
17:57 < micah> sure hold on
17:57 < micah> its neat
17:57 < jb-> sudo screen
17:58 < jb-> of course you'll meet with messages like "the one that reads that is nut".
17:58 < jb-> or it is something different? :p
17:59 < mtoups> well i assume we have to do something special to let multiple tty's attach to one screen
18:00 < jb-> shit, 70 list have gone private in the last month.
18:00 < mtoups> hmm, i wonder if that's people being paranoid about spam harvesting
18:01 < micah> ok
18:01 < micah> on sarai
18:01 < micah> sudo screen -r micah/pizza
18:02 < micah> you guys should do that
18:02 < pabs> a shared screen sounds scary
18:02 < mtoups> heh
18:02 < mtoups> yeah one typer at a time please
18:02 < pabs> btw ppl, what is mailgraph.pl
18:02 < mtoups> i've done this with vnc... its even worse with mice
18:03 < pabs> hahhah, that's funny stuff mtoups
18:04 < micah> pabs?
18:04 < micah> ar eyou coming into the screen?
18:04  * pabs has no sudo
18:04 < jb-> this is crazy,
18:04 < mtoups> oh
18:04 < mtoups> we should have given pabs sudo a long time ago
18:04 < micah> heh
18:04 < micah> yeah really
18:05 < micah> jb: are you in the screen?
18:05 < mtoups> heh, so i assume i can't sniff micah's password this way
18:05 < jb-> yep, but i'm not in the 'w' for some reason.
18:05 < micah> pabs: you have sudo now
18:05 < pabs> btw, ppl screen is new to me, so be patient
18:05 < micah> jb: you are in multi screen?
18:05 < mtoups> when everyone is there i can get things rolling
18:05 < jb-> micah: yep
18:06 < micah> pabs, type your message and cntrl-c when finished so you dont type a command
18:07 < pabs> this is freaking weird
18:07 < micah> totally :)
18:07 < micah> I dont get beeps, so I dont care :)
18:07 < mtoups> so ok this is the source to the debian package... their source
18:08 < mtoups> before we build the package we want to apply the patches
18:08 < pabs> i get ^@ signs
18:08 < mtoups> but i also want to get build deps done too.. perhaps we can do this in parallel
18:08 < pabs> wget em mtoups
18:08 < micah> btw. for future reference
18:08 < micah> to set up a multi screen:
18:08 < micah> user 1 types:
18:08 < micah> screen -S pizza
18:08 < micah> ^a: addacl root
18:08 < micah> ^a: multiuser on
18:08 < micah> user 2 does:
18:09 < mtoups> pabs can you start applying the patch? i gotta quick phone call..
18:09 < micah> sudo screen -r user1/pizza
18:09 < pabs> ok
18:09 < micah> pabs takes over the wheel
18:10 < pabs> applying now
18:10 < micah> ok go for it
18:10 < pabs> what's this script thing?
18:11 < jb-> weird to see how other ppl type.
18:11 < mtoups> logs everything to a file
18:11 < micah> script logs everything that happens on the screen to a file called typescript
18:11 < pabs> ah, k
18:11 < micah> that way if shit goes off the screen you dont loos eit
18:11 < micah> loose it
18:11  * micah loses it
18:11 < mtoups> do we want to apply the patch from /usr/src ?
18:11 < pabs> here goes
18:11 < pabs> oops
18:11 < jb-> is this sarai or the uml ?
18:11 < micah> sarai
18:12 < micah> and just patching the debian 2.1.4 not the running one
18:12 < pabs> thar we go, patched
18:12 < mtoups> fun fun
18:12  * pietro will watch everything quitely from here
18:12 < pabs> eek, more beeps
18:12 < mtoups> i can take over now ?
18:12 < pabs> mind term shows em as ^@
18:12 < micah> pietro: you can join the screen fun to see people working :)
18:12 < pabs> yup
18:13 < pietro> ok
18:13 < micah> pietro: screen -r micah/pizza
18:13 < mtoups> i'm checking depends
18:13 < pabs> just apt-get build-dep, yeah?
18:14 < pabs> mtoups?
18:14 < mtoups> i guess, i wasn't sure how that would deal with stable vs. unstable
18:14 < pietro> micah: ok i'm in :)
18:14 < pabs> should be ok, i think
18:14 < mtoups> well anyway i think we're good on depends
18:14 < mtoups> actually
18:14 < mtoups> yeah we're good on build depends, i was checking regular depends too
18:15 < pabs> ah, yeha
18:15 < mtoups> so yeah, here goes
18:15 < pabs> dpkg-buildpackage?
18:15 < mtoups> shrug, this is how i'm used to doing it....
18:15 < pabs> whateva
18:15 < mtoups> oh btw, when i did this on another system the actual dpkg -i part took a long time for s
ome reason
18:16 < pabs> yeah, all the templates are config files
18:16 < mtoups> perhaps we should announce now to imc-tech-annouce that a 5-10 minute interruption is co
ming up?
18:16 < mtoups> btw we have the old .deb just in case we need to fall back on it
18:16 < mtoups> plus backups on emma and now sarai.riseup i assume
18:16 < pabs> we're gonna install now?!
18:17 < pabs> btw, the patch has no translations for 6 new messages
18:17 < micah> pabs: wasn't tat what we were talking about doing?
18:17 -!- luis [~email@cbl-233-56.wb.bl.ufmg.br] has quit [Quit: /brb]
18:17 < micah> mtoups: sarai.riseup is not fully sync'd yet
18:18 < pabs> hmm, maybe wait till then (time estimate?)
18:18 < micah> pabs: not until at least 24 hours
18:18 < pabs> hmm
18:18 < micah> its a LOT of data to sync
18:18 < micah> and I'm not even getting it all
18:18 < pabs> shit, we need to work on decentralisation
18:19 < pabs> or the mailman devs do
18:19 < micah> well, we have some good backups
18:19 < mtoups> would tar.bz be faster than rsync for all that stuff?
18:19 < micah> which would allow us to get back online pretty quicker
18:19 < mtoups> isn't is mostly small files/dirs not large quantities of data?
18:19 < micah> mtoups: not for keeping it up todate
18:19 < micah> mtoups: actually, there are some pretty big things that choke things up for a while
18:19 < mtoups> ok
18:19 < mtoups> i thought you just wanted to "seed" it
18:19 < micah> people leaving junk around
18:19 < micah> like /var/mail/listarchives
18:19 < pietro> micah: once we copied stuff in tarball rsync to keep it up to date is better :)
18:19 < mtoups> heh, yeah
18:20 < micah> well, it isn't so easy to seed
18:20 < mtoups> ok, mailman deb is built
18:20 < micah> pabs: so you think we should wait now?
18:20 < pabs> i dunno, i'm hesitant about not testing it first
18:21 < mtoups> pabs, you know the most about the patches so...
18:21 < micah> well, ok
18:21 < micah> so we have this discussion again
18:21 < micah> mtoups can't do it this weekend
18:21 < pabs> mtoups: the ssl patch, did you apply it?
18:21 < mtoups> oh, heh
18:21 < mtoups> good point
18:21 < micah> jb will be drunk
18:21 < mtoups> that wasn't in the big patch?
18:21 < micah> heh
18:21 < pabs> nope
18:22 < mtoups> not even the old ssl patch?
18:22  * micah wondres if irc is going over udp?
18:22 < pabs> nup
18:22 < pabs> as in no ssl at all
18:22 < mtoups> ok that's better then
18:22 < micah> so, can we focus on when we are going to do this?
18:22 < micah> so i can send out an email?
18:23 < mtoups> oh hey, python hackers ...
18:24  * micah sends out email, "we will upgrade mailman today, this weekend or whenever, just so you kn
ow"
18:24 < mtoups> btw do i want to do: (target[0:7] == 'private') ?
18:24 < mtoups> (is the 0:7 some kind of weird array index?)
18:24 < micah> pabs?
18:24 < pabs> late tomorrow night - 0:30 GMT onwards for me
18:24 < pabs> is good if possible
18:24 < mtoups> that's friday morning for you right?
18:24 < micah> mtoups: could you do it then?
18:25 < mtoups> no i will be on the road to boston by then
18:25 < pabs> mtoups: that's how you select chagarcters from 0-7
18:25 < mtoups> pabs: ok that's what i thought
18:25 < pabs> 0:6 is what u want i think
18:25 -!- luis [~email@cbl-233-56.wb.bl.ufmg.br] has joined #listwork
18:26 < mtoups> yeah ok, fixed
18:26 < mtoups> duh
18:26 < micah> mtoups: so you leave for boston on friday?
18:26 < mtoups> well, late thursday night.....
18:26 < mtoups> which is friday in austrailia
18:26 < micah> right, which is about 24 hours from now
18:27 < mtoups> yeah, more or less
18:27 < mtoups> which is why i suggested daytime tomorrow, but that's the middle of the night for pabs
18:27 < micah> well, there is no hurry, we could wait to do the upgrade until everyone is ready
18:27 < mtoups> yeah middle of next week is good for me
18:27 < mtoups> weekends bad
18:27 < pabs> monday/tues then?
18:27 < micah> we could postpone the upgrade, and resume the agenda
18:27 < micah> works for me
18:28 < micah> mtoups: good fo' you?
18:28 < mtoups> yep
18:28 < micah> ok!
18:28 < mtoups> has jb passed out already?
18:28 < pabs> time?
18:28 < micah> back to the agend
18:28 < micah> a
18:29 < micah> jb is thinking of clever shell things
18:29 < jb-> not me
18:29 < micah> should we do 00gmt?
18:29 < jb-> (sorry i had social obligations)
18:29 < pabs> lib here opens at 00:30
18:29 < micah> k, 00:30?
18:29 < mtoups> feb 10? feb 11?
18:29 < mtoups> we're not talking about sunday right?
18:30 < micah> no monday/tuesday
18:30 < micah> feb 9 for us mtoups
18:30 < mtoups> oh ok, monday night our time
18:31 < mtoups> i dig
18:31 < micah> right
18:31 < micah> ok, so
18:31 < micah> next agena
18:31 < micah> large mboxes
18:31 < micah> jb was pointing out that some .mbox files are getting prtty big
18:31 < micah> although he is failing to find any :)
18:31 < pabs> sorry jb
18:32 < jb-> jeje
18:32 < micah> jb: whats the idea for trimming them?
18:32  * pabs runs man find somewhere else
18:32 < jb-> i was thinking to copy archives in another place, html and all.
18:32 < mtoups> also, what's the rationale?  we've got disk space for them, and the only time it is an i
ssue is when we regenerate ... which only happens when we get those requests
18:33 < jb-> write a RewriteRulle like, if not present, redirect, for html.
18:33 < jb-> and them rm mbox in the mailman tree.
18:33 < micah> jb: but why is this needed?
18:33 < jb-> i dont know.
18:34 < micah> heh
18:34 < jb-> but don't find it nice to have big boxen,
18:34  * pabs adds agenda item: fixing the apache ssl configs to do the /listname redirect too
18:34 < micah> I like jb, he thinks of solutions long before there is a problem :)
18:34 < jb-> thing is that when you rebuild archives you can get really pissed.
18:34 < micah> you mean drunk
18:34 < micah> because you are waiting a long time
18:34 < pabs> how long does rebuilding take jb?
18:34 < jb-> lock time for rebuilding archives is 15min, by default.
18:34 < micah> so you can have 6 beers before it is finished
18:35 < jb-> you can have a lock expiring in the middle of this.
18:35 < mtoups> well, a good way to bring those mboxes down would be to purge the spam from them. :)
18:35 < jb-> then your archives make no sense at all.
18:35 < jb-> (i guess).
18:35 < micah> another good way would be to change our archiver
18:35 < mtoups> ooh yes
18:35 < pabs> eek, lurker would be better, yeah?
18:35 < jb-> well
18:36 < micah> guess we dont know when that'll happen, but we'll know some what better after we finish t
he mailman upgrade
18:36 < jb-> it can't be worse, to start with.
18:36 < mtoups> we can start testing lurker and others on the uml
18:36 < jb-> ah!
18:36 < micah> should we get funky?
18:36 < jb-> www-features!
18:36 < micah> what about it!
18:36 < mtoups> jb-: well... it could be.  mailman is going to want to start the archives over at messag
e "1" so there's the potential to have two message 1's
18:36 < jb-> >50M
18:37 < pietro> and a backup
18:37 < micah> jeez
18:37 < micah> that must be mostly spam?
18:37 < jb-> mtoups: bad ids in archives is a problem..
18:38 < mtoups> mailman does not like the archives changing in any direction except growing chronologica
lly.  this is a good reason to ditch pipermail :)
18:38 < mtoups> imca.tar.gz?
18:38 < pietro> what is imca.tar.gz? a backup of all archives?
18:38 < micah> agreeed
18:38 < micah> dunno
18:38 < micah> heh, its old
18:39 < jb-> yay
18:39 < mtoups> yeah, heh
18:39 < pietro> and huuuuge
18:39 < micah> italy, belgium
18:39 < mtoups> woah, imc-animallibnow?
18:39 < micah> I saw rm
18:39 < micah> yeah weird huh?
18:39 < micah> objections to rm?
18:40 < mtoups> i like old files :)
18:40 < pietro> i guess we'd better move i to another box
18:40 < mtoups> i'm curious about this animllibnow list
18:40  * pabs notes we have some translations: http://translations.indymedia.org/Translations/1075799984
/index_html
18:41 < epsas> [LOGGING NOTE]
18:41 < epsas> i will be AFK, but will leave the logger on (it will rotate to a new file at midnight, Sa
n Francisco time]
18:41 < epsas> http://www.threespeed.org/~epsas/listwork_meeting-2004-02-04
18:42 < jb-> let's rm imca?
18:42 < micah> poof
18:42 < mtoups> so since we're talking about mboxes, and deleting stuff, thoughts on the piping mboxes t
hrough spamassassin?
18:42 < mtoups> last time i brought it up we hesitated because of the archives getting renumbered
18:42 < jb-> mtoups: this is renumber everything,
18:43 < jb-> eh
18:43 < micah> i thought we were going to wait for a new archiver?
18:43 < mtoups> so.... yeah
18:43 < mtoups> wanna talk about that, then?
18:43 < mtoups> heh
18:43 < micah> well
18:43 < micah> lets put it on the agenda
18:43 < mtoups> put lurker on UML, ok, good, let's move on :)
18:43 < micah> heh
18:43 < micah> ok
18:43 < micah> anyone know what this funky shit is?
18:43  * toya is back [TE/gone: 3h36m54s]
18:43 < mtoups> hmmmm
18:43 < mtoups> i might
18:43 < mtoups> yeah
18:43 < micah> lurker?
18:44 < micah> its ginormous
18:44 < mtoups> ok, i think ansti created a user called listarchive to run lurker
18:44 < micah> well ansti...
18:44 < micah> cmi-goiania?
18:44 < jb-> fscking die-go.
18:44 < mtoups> like, a bunch of mail goes to listarchive@indymeda.org which gets piped to lurker...?
i'm trying to remember this
18:44 < mtoups> goiania?
18:44 < jb-> in brazil.
18:44 < micah> well, I am thinking we make it sotp
18:45 < micah> and we have to re-do ansti's lurker stuff
18:45 < mtoups> ah ha
18:45 < micah> because we have no idea what he did/didn't do
18:45 < mtoups> watch
18:45 < micah> weird
18:45 < mtoups> so yeah
18:45 < mtoups> that's what that was supposed to be doing
18:46 < jb-> mmm
18:46 < micah> not sur eI understand that
18:46 < pabs> seems to be turned off
18:46 < pabs> or are # not comments?
18:46 < jb-> throwing in a shell something that comes from a match?
18:46 < jb-> it's a bit hard, no?
18:47 < micah> well
18:47 < micah> those files are big
18:47 < micah> can we make it stop going there and trash them?
18:47 < micah> I'm not really sure how it is doing it
18:48 < mtoups> i used to know...
18:48 < pabs> screen wars r fun!!
18:49 < micah> whoa
18:49 < pietro> my eyes hurt
18:49 < pabs> what are we looking at now?
18:49 < jb-> rmuser listarchive ?
18:50 < jb-> pabs: nobody knows.
18:50 < micah> pabs: /etc/lurker/lurker.conf
18:50 < pabs> ah, k
18:50 < micah> is that user subscribed to all the lists?
18:50 < pietro> am i stoned or imc-austin archives of october 2000 are more than  50 megs big?
18:51 < micah> yeah
18:51 < micah> listarchive is subscribed to all those lists
18:51 < micah> pietro: yeah, that doesn't seem right, but it is
18:51 < jb-> rmuser, then things will bounce and it'll get kicked.
18:51 < micah> ./imc-brasil.mbox/imc-brasil.mbox
18:51 < micah>  :)
18:51 < pabs> can we not just unsubscribe first?
18:52 < jb-> err
18:52 < jb-> take care..
18:52 < mtoups> listarchive@indymedia.org ?
18:53 < micah> . report scripts for lists moderated badly
18:53 < micah> ?
18:54 < mtoups> pietro: wow the imc-austin archives are full of crap
18:54 < jb-> we've talked about a script to tell us what list have shitloads to moderate.
18:54 < mtoups> pietro: 112M for just 2000-october
18:54 < jb-> wow
18:54 < micah> crap?
18:54 < micah> spam?
18:54 < micah> this remove_members takes a long time
18:55 < micah> pietro: hrm
18:55 < micah> I mean
18:55 < mtoups> micah: apparently a whole bunch of 400k messages repeated
18:55 < micah> hrm
18:55 < micah> about remove_member didn't do much
18:57 < mtoups> heh, i thought that said --nousecrack
18:57 < pabs> lol
18:57 < micah> I dont think that --fromall worked
18:57 < micah> or even that remove_member
18:57 < micah> wtf
18:59 < micah> thats the worst script ever
18:59 < micah> doesn;'t tell you when it doesn't do things
19:00 < pietro> micah: isn't "fail silently" a unix programming rule?
19:00 < micah> . report scripts for lists moderated badly
19:00 < micah> . epsas' pyvert
19:00 < micah> . harvesting off-site lists to the agenda
19:00 < micah> . fixing the apache ssl configs to do the /listname redirect too
19:00 < micah> . huge boxes
19:01 < micah> Ouagadougou
19:01 < epsas> anyone still awake even?
19:01 < micah> yeah are you?
19:01 < epsas> yeah, coffee helps
19:01 < epsas> heh
19:02 < jb-> ah
19:02 < jb-> report scripts
19:02 < micah> tgere
19:02 < jb-> python script to report when there are too much things to
19:03 < micah> right
19:03 < jb-> well, i forgot the last word.
19:03 < micah> who has the last word?
19:03 < epsas> fred.
19:03 < jb-> lol
19:03 < pietro> moderate?
19:03 < jb-> yeah, moderate
19:04 < micah> jetlag is setting in on me
19:04 < epsas> i have to meet some peeps fr dinner in about 15 minutes
19:04 < jb-> it's not too hard to write them, i'll do that.
19:04 < jb-> that's it.
19:04 < epsas> so can i like talk about pyvirt quicklike?
19:04 < jb-> wtf is that?
19:04  * micah is going to write an email to imc-tech-announce regarding mailman upgrade
19:04 < micah> its epsas talking about his perversion
19:04 < micah> go for it
19:04 < jb-> cool.
19:05 < epsas> jb- postfix virtual table manipulation
19:05 < epsas> okay - here's the deal
19:05 -!- luis [~email@cbl-233-56.wb.bl.ufmg.br] has quit [Quit: /brb]
19:05 < epsas> i need to find the code -- it was on my old netbsd server before i took that apart to bui
ld another box (long story)
19:05  * pabs ' mind boggles
19:06 < epsas> the data is on the hard drive, but i am having problems finding the code (and the right h
ard drive/partition for that matter)
19:06 < micah>  /home/epsas/pyvirt.py
19:06 < epsas> yeah
19:06 < epsas> basically
19:06 < micah>  /home/epsas/public_html/pyvirt.py
19:06 < micah> on sarai
19:06 < epsas> is it on one of the other servers?
19:06 < epsas> yes!
19:06 < epsas> woot woot woot
19:06 < epsas> okay
19:06 < mtoups> heh
19:06 < epsas> i need to add auth to it and it's done
19:06  * micah hands epsas locate
19:07 < epsas> let me see if sarai login still works (is remembered)
19:07  * epsas is starting to talk like mic.  ph33r.
19:07 < micah> we were talking about possibly using the postfixadmin code at one point
19:07 < jb-> will this do someone@someimc.i.o ?
19:07 < epsas> the one that uses mysql to handle alias mapping?
19:07 < micah> but this has daleks
19:07 < epsas> that is a good one
19:07 < epsas> yes, this one has daleks and it works on plaintext
19:08 < jb-> daleks?
19:08 < epsas> but the mysql one is more robust (ie, it can be plugged into other applications easier)
19:08 < pabs> that script looks broken
19:08 < micah> http://www.high5.net/postfixadmin/
19:08 < epsas> pabs - it is broken
19:08 < micah> Mmmkay?
19:08 < micah> :)
19:08 < pabs> :)
19:08 < micah> i forgot where I put my face
19:08 < mtoups> note - right now many imc's are handling their own imc.indymedia.org mail ... we might have to go one by one to see if we can do mx records
19:09 < epsas> micah - can you email the script to me/the list?
19:09 < mtoups> also we won't be able to use ANY cname's in indymedia.org dns if those hosts are going t
o have MX records
19:09 < jb-> does domain delegation work for mx?
19:09 < epsas> mtoups - well, this is assuming the machine the code is hosted on is the primary MX for t
he domains
19:09 < epsas> jb- yes
19:09 -!- stefani [irc@localhost] has joined #listwork
19:09 < jb-> cool
19:10 < epsas> i don't have my sarai login, and i don't feel like salvaging my pgp key to request it
19:10 < epsas> s/it/a\ new\ one
19:10 < micah> epsas: want it emailed?
19:10 < epsas> yeah
19:10 < micah> can people look at this message to imc-tech-announce?
19:10 < micah> epsas: what address?
19:10 < micah> The listwork team is planning an outage of the IMC lists system on
19:11 < micah> Feb 9th/10th 00:00 GMT. We will be taking things down to upgrade to a
19:11 < micah> newer more robust mailman. Please be aware that any mail that you send
19:11 < micah> to lists.indymedia.org will be spooled and delivered once things are
19:11 < micah> up, but expect to not receive email for a few hours while we perform
19:11 < micah> the upgrade and do some integrity testing.
19:11 < epsas> micah - epsas@dogsquad.co.uk
19:11 < micah> Thanks for understanding!
19:11 < micah> listworkers
19:11 < epsas> that is good (clear, concise and friendly)
19:11 < micah> epsas
19:12 < micah> -rwxr-xr-x    1 epsas    epsas        6237 Jun 23  2003 pyvirt.py
19:12 < micah> -rwxr-xr-x    1 epsas    epsas        6017 Jun 23  2003 pyvirt.py
19:12 < micah> two different sizes
19:12 < pabs> micah: yeah, wfm, maybe add a note that we'll be on irc
19:12 < epsas> one is probably in the ~/public_html where i hacked on it live
19:12 < epsas> both are good stuff
19:12 < stefani> emma is back up to spool mail now.
19:12 < jb-> epsas one suggestion
19:13 < epsas> jb- okay
19:13 < jb-> you know keynote ?
19:13 < epsas> no, i don't
19:13 < micah> epsas: coming from root
19:13 < epsas> what is keynote?
19:13 < micah> pabs: I'll add that
19:13 < jb-> put keynote in it for auth
19:13 < epsas> micah - thx
19:13 < micah> stefani: great
19:13 < jb-> it's for trust management
19:13 < jb-> like, you hand someone an authorization and she/he can distribute it
19:13 < epsas> jb- do you have URLs?
19:14 < jb-> to friends
19:14 < epsas> oh?  that sounds cool
19:14 < epsas> an URL for keynote?
19:14 < jb-> so that all this people forget about listwork,
19:14 < micah> anyone know what usr/tmp/data.tar.gz
19:14 < jb-> yep
19:14 < micah> is?
19:14 < jb-> one sec.
19:14 < micah> mtoups:
19:14 < stefani> http://www.cis.upenn.edu/~keynote/
19:14 < epsas> stefani - graci
19:14 < jb-> epsas: http://www.cis.upenn.edu/~keynote/
19:14 < mtoups> oh
19:14 < jb-> epsas: there's an rfc also
19:14 < stefani> de nada
19:15 < mtoups> i bet that's /var/lib/mailman/data ...
19:15 < mtoups> from oldsarai
19:15 < mtoups> yeah
19:15 < jb-> epsas: and a python module 've done, i can mail it to you.
19:15 < pabs> heldmessages
19:15 < micah> mtoups: can I trash both of those?
19:15 < mtoups> based on the date, yeah
19:15 < epsas> jb- yes, that would be great
19:15 < mtoups> you just looked at one of them
19:16 < mtoups> we can compare disk performance to bonnie3 in the future
19:16 < micah> rigt :)
19:16 < mtoups> the 746 bytes will probably be tolerable
19:16 < micah> heh
19:16 < micah> I was only concerned about the big ones :)
19:16 < micah> I was syncing hem
19:16 < micah> them
19:16 < micah> and ddnt want to
19:16 < micah> ok, I am tired
19:17 < mtoups> ah i see
19:17 < mtoups> hey whatever happened to the old sarai box?  did it make it to the west coast or what?
19:18 < micah> heh
19:18 < micah> goooood question
19:18 < epsas> west coast don't play!
19:18 < micah> I should send that person an email
19:18 < epsas> okay - doing dinner... logger on
19:18 < mtoups> later epsas
19:19 < pabs> cya epsas
19:19 < jb-> later epsas
19:20 < micah> ok
19:20 < micah> I sent kclair an email about old sarai
19:20 < micah> . harvesting off-site lists to the agenda
19:20 < micah> . fixing the apache ssl configs to do the /listname redirect too
19:20 < micah> thats all in the agenda
19:20 < mtoups> ok, so the off-site list patch is back once we upgrade?
19:20 < pabs> yup
19:20 < micah> that will be nice
19:20 < micah> pabs: what on that wiki page is not in the existing xml file?
19:20 < pabs> i added a coupla extra features too
19:21 < mtoups> so we need to populate the xml file?
19:21 < pabs> there is like 10 lists in the xml file
19:21 < pabs> plus a foolist one
19:21 < pabs> yes micah
19:23 < pabs> at some point i'll change the web interface so u can do it from there
19:24 < micah> nice
19:25 < micah> so we need some harvester
19:25 < micah> s
19:25 < pabs> i can't really do it atm, have to go sort welfare stuff
19:25 < micah> I dont think i can continue
19:25 < micah> jet lag hit me like bricks
19:25 < pabs> i reckon ppl do it when they can and put on the wiki
19:26 < mtoups> yeah we can harvest away
19:26 < mtoups> micah shoudl sleep
19:26 < pabs> indeed
19:27 < jb-> one thing
19:27 < jb-> wondering if we can do something listwork with berkman
19:27 < mtoups> like what kind of stuff?
19:27 < jb-> put there a couple of lists, etc.
19:28 < jb-> i mean, we wont be able to have all lists on sarai for eternity
19:28 < jb-> we already have loads of them.
19:28 < micah> I need to put berkman pictrus online
19:28 < jb-> kewl
19:29 < mtoups> so will those lists be list@berkman.indymedia.org?
19:29 < mtoups> or do we have an alias and have sarai pass them to berkman?
19:29 < mtoups> (and in that case, if sarai goes down that list is still screwed)
19:29 < jb-> we could work on MX?
19:29 < jb-> listname@someimc.*
19:30 < jb-> put sarai as a secondary, and have berkman as a secondary for sarai.
19:31 < pabs> ooh, distributed mailing lists
19:31 < pabs> that sounds scary
19:31 < jb-> scary?
19:32 < mtoups> well, how is that different from having emma as a secondary?
19:32 < mtoups> both berkman and sarai run mailman?  then how do they stay in sync?
19:32 < jb-> err wait
19:32 < jb-> they dont need to be in sync.
19:32 < pabs> scary as in the potential for pissing a lot of ppl off is fairly high
19:32 -!- stefani_ [irc@localhost] has joined #listwork
19:32 -!- stefani [irc@localhost] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
19:32 < jb-> say, we can have foobar imc with lists on berkman
19:33 < jb-> mx for foobar.indy.org is berkman.
19:33 < jb-> everything stored there, nothing distributed.
19:33 < pabs> ah, k
19:33 < pabs> hmm
19:34 < pabs> what if ppl send to imc-foo@lists.indymedia.org? setup a forward?
19:34 -!- stefani_ is now known as stefani
19:34 < mtoups> sure, then we have to manage two installations of mailman and spamassassin and postfix i
nstead of one... two machines that could crash.... i'm not saying we don't need to distribute, but there
 is a cost
19:34 < jb-> agreed.
19:34 < jb-> but
19:35 < jb-> dunno.
19:35 < mtoups> i don't see it as reducing downtime, just reducing how bad things are if there is downti
me :)
19:35 < mtoups> actually, downtime is twice as likely, but only half as bad :)
19:35 < mtoups> interesting tradeoff
19:35 < jb-> yeah
19:35 < pabs> haha
19:35 < jb-> but one thing is we'll need to start doing something at a moment.
19:35 < mtoups> what i like about the idea is that we have something in place in case sarai explodes or
something
19:36 < jb-> also i have a hidden agenda.
19:36 < mtoups> cuz that'll happen sooner or later too
19:36 < jb-> which is to test pretty cool antispam features you can stuff in bsd firewalls.
19:36 < mtoups> micah, is seattle in an earthquake zone?
19:36 < jb-> actually seattle is in an earthquake because of sarai.
19:37 < jb-> too heavy.
19:37 < mtoups> heh
19:37  * toya is away [out back scolding the horse.../l:on]
19:37 < pietro> the last seattle earthquake happenend when people were migrating site to stallman
19:39 < mtoups> ha, seriously?
19:39  * pabs wonders how to quit screen
19:39 < mtoups> pabs: ctrl-a, d
19:40 < pabs> anyone have time to do that apache ssl config thing (if not i'll do it tomorrow)?
19:40 < jb-> shit check out #tech
19:41 < jb-> http://sarai.indymedia.org/cgi-bin/mailgraph.cgi
19:41 < mtoups> remind me what the apache ssl config thing is?
19:41 < pabs> (http://lists.indy/somelist works, https://lists.indy/somelist does not)
19:41 < mtoups> ah, right
19:42 < pietro> mtoups: yeah and it also fucked our old email server turttle
19:42 < mtoups> jb-: btw you noticed suprma@primus@ca is still there?
19:42 < stefani> seattle does have earthquake,s  but i do not worry toooo much.
19:42 < jb-> yes
19:42 < pabs> what happened in may?
19:42 < stefani> may?
19:43 < mtoups> new sarai came online in may
19:43 < pabs> ah
19:43 < stefani> i recall that very well.
19:43 < pietro> good night folks
19:43 < jb-> night
19:43 < pabs> whoa max 469 msgs / min
19:43 < pabs> night
19:43 < jb-> sip
19:44 < mtoups> night jb
19:44 -!- pietro [irc@localhost] has quit [Quit: Client exiting]
19:44 < pabs> so is that all?
19:44 < pabs> (for the meeting)
19:45 < jb-> i think yeah.
19:45 < jb-> 5am here.
19:45 < jb-> a bit tired.
19:45 < pabs> :)
19:45 < pabs> night then
19:45 < mtoups> i'd like to point out that pabs has done a lot of hacking on mailman and give him respec
t for that :)
19:45 < jb-> yeah that's pretty cool.
19:45 < pabs> aww, shucks, hope i didn't fuck up
19:45 < pabs> sudo is my reward i guess
19:46 < jb-> yeah, otherwise more work and more respect.
19:46 < jb-> pabs: it's insane you didnt have sudo before.
19:46 < pabs> heh, i hadn't done much before
19:46 < jb-> oh well.
19:47 < pabs> at some point it'd be great if ppl hassle the mm devs to get these patches in
19:47 < pabs> or the debian devel
19:47 < jb-> you dropeed them a line?
19:47 < mtoups> yeah.  we said that in june :)
19:47 < mtoups> matze emailed mailman-dev a long time ago i think
19:47 < micah> earthquake?
19:48 < pabs> yah, now the patches should apply to the latest version tho, so it's easier for them
19:48 < pabs> anyway i'll split em up and upload to sf.net when i get my home net conn restored
19:48 < jb-> is there a public cvs for mailman ?
19:48 < pabs> yeah, sf.net i think
19:48 < jb-> ok
19:49 < pabs> mtoups: so you can finish the ssl patch before the next upgrade meeting?
19:49 < pabs> or is it done now?
19:50 < mtoups> it should be
19:50 < mtoups> i mean, i didn't have to do much ...  :)
19:50 < mtoups> well
19:50 < mtoups> we might need an apache redirect also
19:50 < pabs> ah, k, does it apply over the massive patch easy enuF?
19:50 < pabs> yeah, of course
19:51 < pabs> but the idea of it is just to change relevant links to https
19:51 < mtoups> but this will have the form submit and such go via ssl also which is necessary
19:51 < mtoups> otherwise it doesn't work
19:51 < pabs> yeah
19:51 < pabs> i really should go
19:52 < jb-> gotta sleep also.
19:52 < jb-> good work kidz
19:52 < jb-> see ya
19:52 < mtoups> yeah later folks
19:52 -!- jb- [irc@localhost] has quit [Quit: patapouf.]
19:52 < pabs> bye all, sleep well
19:52 -!- pabs [~webguest@liblab82.murdoch.edu.au] has left #listwork []
21:06 -!- stefani [irc@localhost] has left #listwork [Client Exiting]
--- Log closed Thu Feb 05 00:00:42 2004

-- EpsasNova - 10 Feb 2004
Topic revision: r2 - 03 Feb 2006, AlsteR
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